I give up! - Alfa Romeo Forum
You are currently unregistered, register for more features.    
 8Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
(Post Link) post #1 of 33 Old 06-05-16 Thread Starter
Status: Angel tuned tyre burner
AO Silver Member
 
Alfa.Romeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Kent
Posts: 2,128
I give up!

Trying to find an annoying ratte from the front left corner suspension. It's a knocking rattle on uneven surfaces at sub 30mph speeds, that sound's like arb rattle. Arb bushes are cracked on edges but seem tight apart from that. I've now replaced lower and upper arm's complete, track rod end,shock and spring, top mount, arb drop links and front tyres. Still persists and everything's tight with no play anywhere. I'm starting to wonder if it could be a faulty shock even though it's only under 6 months old (noise started after 2 months of new springs/shocks)
Alfa.Romeo is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Status: -
AO Member
 
richydraper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Coventry
County: West Midlands
Posts: 254
is it:-
a) a rattle (like a skeleton in a biscuit tin)
b) a 'tinkle' (like a 10mm spanner dropped on a concrete floor)
c) a knock (like when the arms are shot)
d) a creak (like plastic dash trim against leather dash)
e) a dull thud (like when you hit a small pothole in the road)

i've personally either got or had a, b, c, and d on my last 3 cars at various times (but thats a story for another day). Does it happen more or less with any particular degree of steering input whilst driving under 30mph?

Can you make it worse by either jacking up the corner or by applying full lock in either direction?

Can you replicate it whilst not moving?

sorry for the 'pointless' questions but depending on your answers i am hopefully getting at something
alfafanboy likes this.

Rich

'07 159 Lusso Saloon, 2.4 JTDm, Oltremare Blue.
'99 Fiat Coupe, 2.0 20v VIS, Portofino Blue, Full Leather, Mani-Back Longlife Custom S/S Exhaust.
richydraper is offline  
(Post Link) post #3 of 33 Old 07-05-16 Thread Starter
Status: Angel tuned tyre burner
AO Silver Member
 
Alfa.Romeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Kent
Posts: 2,128
It's like a knock sound, not a metallic sound. Like worn bushes. It not affected by steering, braking or throttle input. Just very affected by rutted roads around 20-30mph, sounds like a bush has failed and something is loose. The noise is gone at 40mph upwards

Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
Alfa.Romeo is offline  
 
Status: -
AO Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: New Zealand
County: -
Posts: 2,339
ARB bushes. Remove the drop links and tie up the ends of the roll bar with cable ties. Go for a drive - if the noise is gone, it'll be the roll bar bushes (assuming the drop links are good).
Chipmik and alfafanboy like this.
sprint_veloce is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
Chipmik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Denmark
County: Nordjylland
Posts: 554
Garage

Member car:

159 2,4 JTDm 210

Hmm...Next to the sprinklertank theres a hole leading to where subframe bolts to car..Down there lies the cap for my sprinklertank (Thank you daughter :-) ) ..Could be that som had dropped a bolt/nut down there & thats what your listening to ? :-) Far out idea, but you seem to have tried the obvious ones...Be VERY sure your droplinks are 1000% ok..They can be surprisingly shortlived
alfafanboy likes this.
Chipmik is offline  
(Post Link) post #6 of 33 Old 07-05-16 Thread Starter
Status: Angel tuned tyre burner
AO Silver Member
 
Alfa.Romeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Kent
Posts: 2,128
Thanks for replies. The ARB droplinks are new as replaced them trying to solve this noise. As is upper and lower arm and tie rod end. My mechanic can't explain it either, the sound is ARB knocking to a tee but no play and bushes appear in tact. I'll disconnect the ARB drop links and take it for a spin when I get a minute, a fair suggestion
Alfa.Romeo is offline  
Status: Still engineering
AO Silver Member
 
Old Engineer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Esher
County: Surrey
Posts: 2,062
Images: 12
Is it a rattle sometimes described as "like a heavy 1 metre cable bouncing on a metal chassis rail"?
Old Engineer is offline  
(Post Link) post #8 of 33 Old 07-05-16 Thread Starter
Status: Angel tuned tyre burner
AO Silver Member
 
Alfa.Romeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Kent
Posts: 2,128
Hmmm, not really. It sounds near enough exactly the same as the knocking you get when the upper arm is gone. Incredibly similar

Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
Alfa.Romeo is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
Chipmik's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Denmark
County: Nordjylland
Posts: 554
Garage

Member car:

159 2,4 JTDm 210

Are you sure its the right type upper you got? Theres 2..Depending on alu or iron-arms (>2007 & <2007)
Chipmik is offline  
(Post Link) post #10 of 33 Old 07-05-16 Thread Starter
Status: Angel tuned tyre burner
AO Silver Member
 
Alfa.Romeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Kent
Posts: 2,128
Yup, it grates me every time as it costs a load more

Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
Chipmik likes this.
Alfa.Romeo is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
sketchy19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: UK
County: South East
Posts: 85
Is there play or knock with the car on the ground on any of the wheels.
I had similar on my car. When in air, no play all tight when on floor it would knock. See youtube link with sound

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HPPtyc00-Gc

On my car it was the top arm that i know you have changed but the point is that the knock was only present with the car on the ground.

Hope this helps
sketchy19 is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: United Kingdom
County: Suffolk
Posts: 71
Check to see if the brake calliper bolts are tight. I had a calliper bolt work loose and fall out shortly after buying my 147 last year which made a knocking noise. I checked everything on the near side front corner then noticed the missing bolt. Replaced it and that sorted the noise out.
Lord_of_beard likes this.
Mille Miglia is offline  
(Post Link) post #13 of 33 Old 08-05-16 Thread Starter
Status: Angel tuned tyre burner
AO Silver Member
 
Alfa.Romeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Kent
Posts: 2,128
Thanks for all the replies and suggestions. Here's a couple of video's showing the jangly knocking sound:
https://youtu.be/VgZIvmmxprA
https://youtu.be/G_mBK3q5NHY
https://youtu.be/zl6rMWY-MX8
Alfa.Romeo is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
sketchy19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: UK
County: South East
Posts: 85
Sound more like a dull heavy rattle than a Knock if i was hearing the right noise.

Is the Exhaust and all its shields tight and in place? I know you have new shocks but are the bumpstops new as well? are they located properly?
sketchy19 is offline  
(Post Link) post #15 of 33 Old 09-05-16 Thread Starter
Status: Angel tuned tyre burner
AO Silver Member
 
Alfa.Romeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Kent
Posts: 2,128
Yeah it is a dull heavy rattle, better description. There is a exhaust heatshield hanging down on the rear but the noise is definitely from the front left corner. It's got new top mounts, didn't know the 159 had bump stops?

Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
Alfa.Romeo is offline  
Status: loving a shiny bella called Monica
AO Silver Member
 
bigjim's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: United Kingdom
County: Northamptonshire
Posts: 1,993

Member car:

159 2.4 Lusso

not the engine tray cover is it? flapping about?
Lord_of_beard likes this.
bigjim is offline  
(Post Link) post #17 of 33 Old 09-05-16 Thread Starter
Status: Angel tuned tyre burner
AO Silver Member
 
Alfa.Romeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Kent
Posts: 2,128
I'll take a look but don't think so, sounds like a suspension component when heard in the flesh. Just seems crazy it's so prominent as you can hear but me and 2 other mechanics can't pin it down

Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
Alfa.Romeo is offline  
(Post Link) post #18 of 33 Old 09-05-16 Thread Starter
Status: Angel tuned tyre burner
AO Silver Member
 
Alfa.Romeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Kent
Posts: 2,128
Sketchy, I rocked it on the ground like in your video, quiet as a mouse

Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
Alfa.Romeo is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
sketchy19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: UK
County: South East
Posts: 85
Hmmmm.

The bump stops fit on the damper strut inside the gaiter. They clip in place with a plastic clip that can easily break. This can cause them to drop down and rattle.

It is also incredible how sound can travel though a car so it can be really hard to pinpoint the location.

Are your tyre to arch gaps the same (car sits level) have you dropped the belly pan down to see if there are any looses or broken brackets or fixings that could be bouncing around
sketchy19 is offline  
Status: Still engineering
AO Silver Member
 
Old Engineer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Esher
County: Surrey
Posts: 2,062
Images: 12
The exhaust is an amplifier for travelling sound but yours sounds dull enough to be a suspension component
Old Engineer is offline  
(Post Link) post #21 of 33 Old 10-05-16 Thread Starter
Status: Angel tuned tyre burner
AO Silver Member
 
Alfa.Romeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Kent
Posts: 2,128
Just disconnected the top of the anti roll bar drop links, taken it for a spin. Still the same Looked at the undertray, mounts, checked for play etc, nothing. All tight as a drum. What's the thoughts, could this be the shock making this noise? This noise started around the same time the front left also started making a weird hydraulic noise that I think was also coming from this shock. The shock is around 5 months old, but was very cheap (FK sport tech) Problem is, it looks fine and I threw 2 lower arms, an upper arm, tie rod end, top mounts and arb drop links a this to no avail
Alfa.Romeo is offline  
(Post Link) post #22 of 33 Old 10-05-16 Thread Starter
Status: Angel tuned tyre burner
AO Silver Member
 
Alfa.Romeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Kent
Posts: 2,128
Quote:
Originally Posted by sketchy19 View Post
Is the Exhaust and all its shields tight and in place?
Now been under and refitted the exhaust heat shield. Front noise persists (but at least the knocking you can hear of the heatshield in the back is gone )
Alfa.Romeo is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: United Kingdom
County: Worcestershire
Posts: 193

Member car:

159SW 1.9JTDM

I had this, it was the top nut on the suspension (the one that's a total PITA to tighten when you change the springs) it had worked itself loose after I'd changed the springs and the car had settled. It took a few weeks for it to become apparent. 11mm offset and a 5mm socket IIRC.
MattB159 is offline  
(Post Link) post #24 of 33 Old 10-05-16 Thread Starter
Status: Angel tuned tyre burner
AO Silver Member
 
Alfa.Romeo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Kent
Posts: 2,128
How do you tighten it? Do you need to compress the spring first?

Sent from my E6653 using Tapatalk
Alfa.Romeo is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: United Kingdom
County: Worcestershire
Posts: 193

Member car:

159SW 1.9JTDM

Something like this. But with the Alfa the spanner goes further down into the top mount. IIRC it's easier to hold the spanner and tighten the ratchet but it's backwards to what you would think.

Please feel free for anyone else to correct me as it was a while ago that I had to do it.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg TOPMOUNT SCREW.jpg (35.6 KB, 11 views)
MattB159 is offline  
Reply

Go Back   Alfa Romeo Forum > Supported Alfa Romeo Models > Technical & Vehicle Assistance > Alfa 159, Brera & 946 Spider

Tags
give

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome