159 TI Suspension Upgrade Advice - Page 7 - Alfa Romeo Forum
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Well the ride on my car is much improved with the Bilstein B4 and Eibach springs, the fronts give a nice controlled, firmish but very comfortable ride over rough bits. The rears seem okay, but not totally solid like on my GT, not sure if there's other components on the rear apart from droplinks that could do with freshening up, maybe some of the bushes aren't so good.

I do have a bit of a concern on how the springs hold the back up. Ride height all round doesn't seem any different to the standard TI height, but the Eibachs defo sag more than the TI springs when the car is loaded up. I noticed with just the kids in the other day that the back end had gone down a fair bit, but just had a fairly large Woman in the back and the rear suspension didn't feel great. I might load the bike rack up tomorrow and see what the sag is like, because if the suspension doesn't take it, it's not gonna be a winner. Bizarre that my GT on Eibachs never grounds out even massively loaded, but when I put Eibachs on my old 156 SW, I had to take them off fairly quickly because they couldn't take much load at all.

Anyone using these springs on saloon or Sw that loads up a lot, maybe bikes on the back, camping equipment etc, any probs grounding out/ hitting bump stops?

They are defo the correct springs.
I studied the rear set up recently and it is an interesting design. The top lateral link is obviously shorter so that you get negative camber as the suspension compresses. But the trailing arm and the lower lateral link appear to work against each other. The lower link is a rigid 'blade' so must be expecting to bend in one direction. It seems that under light loading the front of the trailing arm slides inwards so that you get Toe In. Under heavy cornering the 'blade' must bend to give Toe Out.
Obviously lowering the car will alter the effectiveness of this design but I certainly wouldn't want to play with the rubbers.
I was also amused by the parts diagram that shows the 'upright' upside down with two fixings at the top when they are installed at the bottom.
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I'm sure you all know the form, something annoys you on the car and your straight on Autotrader or sites pricing up PCP deals Obviously, unless you've Maserati money, nothing floats your boat and suddenly 550 for a set of rear wishbones seems a decent idea in view of how much you want to keep the car, but have it right.

I was kicking myself for not taking pre Eibach measurements, but luckily found some notes from last August saying my TI suspension sat at 90mm rim to arch, all round. Full tank of fuel barely made any difference, in fact I always thought the car felt nicer with a full tank. So in fact I've raised the height 10mm so far with the Eibachs.
Full tank of fuel on the Eibachs, that's probably around 70kg of fuel so say 45kg of fuel has dropped it 8mm, I got my Kids to get in, combined weight 68kg, rear went down another 10mm, that's with an empty boot, so God knows how it's going to handle a boot full of kit and a roof box.
Maybe Alfa knew a little something when they specced the rear springs (apart from they might snap), in that a SW was going to be used loaded up a lot. Maybe Eibach's theory is they make for single driver performance.

The Sportwagon rear springs are 5mm longer untensioned and slightly thicker wire then saloon, but I'd be happier if they raised the rear another 10mm as standard, not as much rake as a GTA sport wagon, but same idea.

Could these be ordered from Eibach?. Ned?

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I'll take measurements from the rear of my sw. I have increased knocking over bumps when i have extra load in the back. I have putchased new drop links for the rear which i need to install in the hope this solves the knocking.
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I'll take measurements from the rear of my sw. I have increased knocking over bumps when i have extra load in the back. I have putchased new drop links for the rear which i need to install in the hope this solves the knocking.
I think on the other post it's been proved that the ARB links are not the source of the noise. I've moved on to the tailing arm front sliding bush. The bush is hidden above a plastic shield which I need to get off.
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What did you spray on those bushes OE? I'm totally confused as to what product is safe on the bushes. Got a squigy noise on the left side, pretty sure from one of those bushes, it'll be a 2 man job to pinpoint it though, it's pretty hard trying to bounce the car whilst on your back listening.
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What did you spray on those bushes OE? I'm totally confused as to what product is safe on the bushes. Got a squigy noise on the left side, pretty sure from one of those bushes, it'll be a 2 man job to pinpoint it though, it's pretty hard trying to bounce the car whilst on your back listening.
"Squigy Noise" is spot on as a description of our noise. Perhaps we should start a new post with this heading. I sprayed mine with a graphite lubricant. It's not cured but I think the noise is reduced. If yours is like mine it will be worse with a load in the rear. So that's my next test (my wife isn't heavy enough). I really need to get the protecting under tray off.
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Having TWO! broken TI springs, one in the front and the back, I have just ordered B4 dampers and Eibach prokit. This thread came at a perfect timing.
Can't wait to get them fitted by my garage.

Thinking about changing my front upper wishbones myself.
Dit them on my old 156. Are changing the 159's harder or easier?
(had big problems getting the ones on the 156 off, but thanks to this forum i managed to get the job done

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I was also recommended to get the dust protection covers also, or could I use the old ones?
What about the rubber pad between the dampers and the spring?
Do I need to change this?
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The B4's will take the original bump stop rubbers and dust covers fine. Upper wishbones are very easy to remove especially if the damper/spring is removed. Just 2 bolts to remove with a torx socket and then the ball joint which I didn't need a ball joint tool for. It just knocked out. If your getting a garage to do your shocks, it'd be madness not to let them do the upper wishbones at the same time, it'll take them 5 mins.
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If Powerflexing at same time as getting B4 and Eibachs fitted, should you still change the upper wishbones?
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Hopefully you'll not need to change the wishbone. You may want to undo the wishbone ball joint, wiggle it around, if it's jangly, you'll need a new wish one, if not, happy days.
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The B4's will take the original bump stop rubbers and dust covers fine. Upper wishbones are very easy to remove especially if the damper/spring is removed. Just 2 bolts to remove with a torx socket and then the ball joint which I didn't need a ball joint tool for. It just knocked out. If your getting a garage to do your shocks, it'd be madness not to let them do the upper wishbones at the same time, it'll take them 5 mins.

Thanks a lot!
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I've improved the 'Squidgy Noise'. I'll start a new post for this problem.
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I've improved the 'Squidgy Noise'. I'll start a new post for this problem.
It's just dawned on me that I have too (possibly temporarily). I just went out for a speed bump test, mainly to see how much the back end thuds down on these Eibachs. It's so similar to the way my 156 SW thudded down on B6's and Eibachs, so i think it's more spring related than damping. Perhaps the thudding is me getting used to it being more planted, it doesn't bottom out or anything, it just doesn't feel supportive.
So I was hitting the speed bumps pretty quickly, car takes them incredibly well, but it's not all together, but I don't remember hearing any squiging, I did use a lot of silicone on the bushes earlier today so fingers crossed.

Re the knocking around the B pillars- I'm now convinced it's a combo of sticky rubbers and door alignment. I'd sorted mine to the point you really had to be listening carefully, but having realigned the rear passenger side door, I thought I'd tighten up the Driver's door. Basically I could pressure the door with my hands and it would knock, so I tightened the door catch up, taking it off the alignment marks. The knocking noise in cabin is way worse now even though the door is solid to the shove, my noise is coming from the seals, not the catch, it's so obvious to the ear now.
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Sorry to derail but it is suspensio related. What affects the ride height on the rear. Ive always suspected the rear offside is slightly lower than nearside. On closer inspection i can see a small patch on the wheel arch liner where it looks like the wheel is catching. Im going to compare spring part numbers to verify they are identical. Could the differnt ride height point to a worn bush somewhere?
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Discovered saloon springs have been fitted instead of correct sw specific ones. Hopefully this will be the reason for uneven sag and knocking. Correct springs ordered on approx 3 week lead time.
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I've got the correct rear Eibach springs on my SW, the ride height is perfectly even all around, 10mm higher than the TI. It's got to the point now where it's good and firm with just me in it, but it's crap with any load in. I had the seats down yesterday with just 40kg of Ikea flat pack and you can feel the back end just lose all it's support, especially noticeable on road imperfections. So there's no way this is going to be useable like it was with the TI springs, like 4 bikes on the tow bar, full boot , 4 passengers and a full roof box.

I've been swinging from is it springs? to is it dampers?, considering one of my rear TI dampers was totally done, (the rod doesn't even come back out of the cylinder) and the other was barely much better, yet it never felt saggy or dropped like a stone on imperfections. So that to me shows the dampers have nothing to do with saggyness. There's also the fact that I can compress the coils relatively easily with my fingers on the Eibachs yet not on the TI's.

I'm having some spacers made by Peter Cambridge to see if that helps and I'm also going to buy some Grayston coil assisters just to see what effect they have and hopefully prove it's the springs that are too soft.

One of my rear TI springs is going off to Eibach, it'll take a while, but I'm hoping they tweak the rates (v doubtful!) of their rears, because basically my car will be unusable as a Sportwagon Van otherwise. Failing that, I'm going back to TI springs or possibly get some made up in Sheffield.

I really should've learned my lesson when I had a similar, but worse situation on the 156 Wagon with Eibachs.

On the plus side, I had a second to last straw situation with the 159 yesterday, just got sick of it being a lump since all the Powerflex stuff came off. After a session with Peter Cambridge, the front end feels like I've had 4 bags of sand taken out of the engine bay, it's no nimble beast, but it feels so much cleaner. if you think your 159/Brera isn't so good at handling, before you get too down, go and see this guy, you'll be 145 poorer, but so much richer. Oh and he agreed the back end was not good.
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Had my Sportwagon lowered with some beautiful Italian finery today, not measured the drop, but I reckon it's about 40-50mm rim to arch. Yeah baby!
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Bloody hell! That is low.

what are you going to do about speed bumps???

I have a notorious time up here in Newcastle as my area is full of those barstard things and when I hear my wheels grinding against the arch it makes my stomach curl!
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Well I was hoping for a few more comments about my lowering with the Italian coilovers, I expected to get a slating, so either you Folk are too polite, you didn't give a toss either way or you actually like the look.

Anyway, the 'Italian Finery' I fitted was actually just some Italian wall tiles in the boot (yes, I'd had a drink last night). I should weigh them to see how much weight I put in the boot, it wasn't that much. The photo is really there to show what rubbish these Sportwagon Eibach rear springs are, really not fit for (my) purpose. The car's rear end has not been 'squiging' after being lubed up recently, but it certainly did when this low, the exhaust rears were banging away too.
The fact remains that even with the original TI springs sitting 10mm lower than the Eibachs both unloaded, with load the Eibachs drop way more, so if anyone's thinking they're uprated from anything other the Lusso springs, think again. Must've been some serious seconds of R&D done on these springs.
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Wow! That is some serious drop
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That's quite some drop. If you know the weight of the tiles we should be able to roughly calculate the spring rate.
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Well, I don't like it at all mate, but each to their own!
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Well, I don't like it at all mate, but each to their own!
Like what?
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Well, I don't like it at all mate, but each to their own!
I take it you didn't read that is was actually ceramic tiles in the boot that was causing the drop, not any coilovers. I really wouldn't want a normal car that low

Anyway, I've worked out the tile's weight. I had 180kg spread in the boot, me at 75kg and 45kg of tiles on the passenger seat.
I reckon the back dropped almost 55mm with that load.
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