Power Loss with Diesels: Guide - Page 2 - Alfa Romeo Forum
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can anyone tell me exactly what valve/solenoid that MES is referring to when its tries to do actuator test on the fuel pressure regulator? Where exactly is the valve so i can go look at it and check wiring etc.
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I had a similar problem last Summer ( didn't see this thread then ) with power loss at low speed, in fact I stalled the Car twice, and thought it was my own fault, but I took it to the Mechanic that looks after my Car, and he thought it was an EGR problem, and he recommended trying " Forte Advanced Diesel Treatment " it wasn't cheap at £20 though, but to be honest, I've never had the same trouble since, and ironically my mileage had only just gone past the 40,000 mark at the time........
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Just bought a 159 2.4 and after a week dodgy tickover & no power at lo revs, stalling etc etc

Took the EGR valve off and cleaned it although it was pretty good anyway - solenoid clean and moving really freely. It has a plate in between the valve and the manifold with 4 6mm (ish) holes in it - not sure if this is some kind of blank plate or not!!

Did the half hour in 4th on the motorway to try and sort the DPF just incase and not a lot seemed to happen!!

Neither of the above made any difference so I unplugged the MAF and hey presto, runs as good as new!!

Time for a clean and if that doesn't work a new one!!

Last edited by Tets; 06-04-14 at 16:18.
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Well i shall update my situation i guess. I had to admit defeat on this as i was moving house, i left the alfa in York with my dad who said he would have a look see if he could find anything i wasn't seeing.

Well he gave in pretty quickly and limped it a garage (supposed alfa specialist), they changed the EGR & MAF (and i think map) for brand new genuine bosch parts and the car did then start running albeit not perfectly. Dad took it back and they got really defensive and refused to accept there was anything else wrong with it but said their computer indicates the DPF is quite blocked and that if we give them another small fortune they would change it.

At this point i told my dad to just take the car and leave it at my mates for me to go collect when i had a chance, i asked my mate if he wouldn't mind dropping the dpf off and seeing what he thought and bash the innards out and in the meantime got a dongle off fixitsan to cancel dpf warnings and regens.

Now turns out when i went to get the car with my dongle in hand and an egr blank that my mate hadn't had time to look at the car and so i decided to do a bit of logging now the car actually runs and drives. And low and behold the dpf pressure differential looks fine to me, there is infact no difference in pressure at all at idle and only a small difference when driving so pretty sure the dpf is not blocked. The car btw has done alot of blasting up and down motorways and has been doing regular regens so i'm not hugely surprised by this, it rarely dives around town and sits in traffic.

And as before, while idling and even driving everything appears to OK apart from this parameter called 'throttle angle' - that is still stuck fast exactly same number as before (4.997).
Now the car in general runs ok now but its not happy starting at all - it almost fires a few times before it actually starts. Once running it idles fine and it goes flat out fine although feels a bit down on power compared to before all this began, it can blast down a motorway in 6th no problem and pull still in 6th.
However, at slow speeds under partial throttle its stuttering, almost like a petrol car misfiring but without the bang - now being they don't have spark plugs my initial thought was this has got to be an injector but again driving under all conditions the injector correction values all look close to zero and all not far from each other and no change when the stutter occurs. Which basically leaves me with this 'throttle angle' value thats staying constant. There must be someone on here that knows exactly what flap/actuator/whatever this is referring to, and if not can someone pretty please with beer on top try connecting MES to their car and checking this value to see if it changes like a think it should.

Do you think i'm at opening up the inlet mani to clean it and that might be the issue, particularly if my old EGR was stuck open a bit i'm thinking it might just be super coked up in the inlet (already checked i have the half plastic half metal one that comes apart) - And if i do do that, i'm thinking this 'throttle angle' must have an actuator - have read something about swirl flaps, could it be this? I have no knowledge of what they do and what they are for or where they are on the jtdm engine.

Any help with this would be greatly appreciated, kinda getting to the end of my tether with it.
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OK done a bit of reading now about swirl flaps..... Is it remotely possible that my throttle angle is the actual TB butterfly and it IS stuck partially open and the swirl flaps are moving as they should - so foot down means flaps open fully and more fuel is delivered and the car works but is slower than should be and at slower speeds they shut and not enough air is delivered and so i get a stutter.

Thoughts?
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There is a throttle butterfly on the inlet to the manifold, but it only closes under certain conditions and I'm not sure what they are. The car will run ok with it jammed wide open, it certainly doesn't work like a petrol engine butterfly.

Fixitsan found the control board for his full of oil and nackered with it stuck open, but the car still ran fine.
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Thanks Pete, perhaps that is the one then - tbh if the car works i couldn't be less bothered about that butterfly being stuck and today i seem to have had a break through. Decided to take the egr off that the garage fitted and see if they used one of the restrictor plate gaskets like i had before or not - they hadn't... Blanked EGR off and it appears to work and go fast again - I'm not jumping for joy just yet, only done about 10 mile test drive but it didn't hesitate when i started it and i couldn't make it stutter so hopefully it sorted. I'll update in a few days when its got a few more miles done.
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With any luck you've sorted it, fingers crossed!
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As a temp measure try blanking the egr, see if that stops it. Your dpf could still be blocked, check
Multiscan differential pressure reading in the dpf section. Could be gunked up inlet manifold. Or badly leaking swirl flaps.
Varoius post on here
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thats what i did - and so far the car works. It still doesn't start very well first start of the day but after that it starts ok. No stutter and drives real nice again so left it blanked.

To be honest i kinda fell out of love with the car and have given it to my dad now as he was in need of a car - i'm back driving my trusty cinquecento now and couldn't be happier. I understand if you all think that i'm mad for preferring my tiny rattly little 90's fiat but i have an addiction to them, had one at all time for about a decade now. Current one runs a 16v engine from a Punto with few mods on it, weighs less than a tonne and has about 90bhp its loads of fun and costs less in fuel than any modern diesel.

I'm sure i will be fixing the alfa next time it goes wrong though so i'll still be about on here i'm sure haha.
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On the way home yesterday evening, I experienced a drop in power and EML came on. Car still drives, but with noticeable lack of power - you can get to 60 miles an hour but it's like driving the wife's Rav 4...

Got home and ran a scan - P1206 clean or replace particle filter. Error caused by a very high reading from the sensor. I assume I need to try a forced regen in the fist instance? Would I be able to do this with the free edition FIAT ECU Scan software or does the 20 minute time limit mean that I will be booted out before the regen completes?

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Power Loss with Diesels: Guide

You need a paid version for it, take it for an Italian tune up. As I've said else where you can get some stuff for the fuel tank that goes through the engine and lowers the burn off temp in the EGR. Or Wurth do some stuff you spray directly into the DPF

Last edited by giblets46; 17-07-14 at 13:03.
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Update - Italian tune up didn't do the trick, so 50 EUR later and a lot of noise and smoke and the regeneration is complete. I had thought it was going to be done as part of the last service as I had already had a DPF and differential pressure sensor issue (the hose that links the DPF to ??? needed to be replaced), but MES told me that the last regen was over 700km ago.

Took it for a good hoon and no errors so I think I'm good - clogging is now 71% however, I think it was ~81% post regen, maybe ~61% after....I have read varying reports as to whether 100% clogging means clear or completely blocked so don't know what to make of that reading.
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My throttle angle is constant at 4.997' which with my experience with the swirl flaps is wide open. Performance with both open is fine, it's pretty dire with the swirl flaps shut...
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Hi all, I'd really like to get some advice as I'm not very familiar with Alfas - I've only owned my 159 JTDm 1.9 2 weeks! I'm having a similar issue as above - limp mode kicks in after small distance with power loss described above. I also have the "Get Engine checked" warning which shows up on start up.

I just took the car to a local garage (not the place I bought it) and had it plugged in. The guy says it was flagging the possibility of 3 issues:
DPF, EGR or Turbo related.

Apparently the DPF is over £1200 to get fixed. He also said my warranty may not cover this problem After reading through a few threads on similar issues, a 'Regen' sounded like it could potentially solve the DPF issue? Whether they'd know this at my local garage - who knows.
I'm not sure whether I should just take the car limping to Alfatechnico where they may be more familiar with these issues?

Any advice greatly appreciated.
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Power Loss with Diesels: Guide

Do you use the car for lots off short journeys,min which case it will probably be the DPF!
First up, clean the EGR as per the guide, it should not be producing a fault code ( but if faulty will contribute to a blocked DPF. For the DPF try an italian tune up. A longish drive 45 mins up and down the motorway in 5th gear. Hopefully a regen will kick in. You can get some products to help this, one you put in the fuel tank ( contains additives which lower the temperature to burn the soot off in the DPF, and wurth do a spray you can out straight in the DPF which is best used when you 'force' a regen with the full multiecuscan software.

You could also try taking the DPF and using a power washer on it ( avoid the catalyst though).

For the turbo the vanes may be sticking have a search on here for it.

But yes auto technio should be able to help. Personally you should be able to clean the EGR and do an italian tune up first ( with some in tank stuff).


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Cheers Giblets. After clearing the error and taking her for a spin to trigger the limp mode, the only fault remaining was the DPF. So the garage ran a forced regen and the power-loss/limp mode issue has gone so far
The car only has 41k miles for a 07 plate so although previous owner looked after the car very well, maybe it wasn't getting the longer cruises it probably wants!
Aiming to do an Italian tune up this week just to stretch her legs after adding some of that magical Wynns cleaner. After that - EGR clean!
The turbo vane sounds interesting as I'm getting a slight stutter around 2k range in 2nd and 3rd. Maybe it's related. Thanks again for the advice
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Cheers Giblets. After clearing the error and taking her for a spin to trigger the limp mode, the only fault remaining was the DPF. So the garage ran a forced regen and the power-loss/limp mode issue has gone so far

The car only has 41k miles for a 07 plate so although previous owner looked after the car very well, maybe it wasn't getting the longer cruises it probably wants!

Aiming to do an Italian tune up this week just to stretch her legs after adding some of that magical Wynns cleaner. After that - EGR clean!

The turbo vane sounds interesting as I'm getting a slight stutter around 2k range in 2nd and 3rd. Maybe it's related. Thanks again for the advice

Quite often if it's been at a dealers for a while it will only have done short demo runs, mine did a regen on the way home!
As for the 2k hiccup, money is on the EGR. I would suggest a restrictive plate when you do it ( diamond shaped plate with a small hole in)


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Originally Posted by giblets46 View Post
Quite often if it's been at a dealers for a while it will only have done short demo runs, mine did a regen on the way home!
As for the 2k hiccup, money is on the EGR. I would suggest a restrictive plate when you do it ( diamond shaped plate with a small hole in)


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Quick update...
EGR has been cleaned and a drilled restrictive plate installed. No more stutter so hopefully that's the DPF and EGR problems solved.

Its a little bit unnerving when you experience this for the first time (especially as I only purchased a month ago) but turned out to be relatively inexpensive and now runs pretty smooth. Touch wood no more issues!
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Update on stuttering problems...
After my original EGR was blanked I was hopeful that the problems would be gone. Unfortunately a chopping noise and slight hesitation on throttle hadn't gone completely and was getting worse. I've since had a brand new replacement EGR (apparently the one I had was a cheap Chinese component). The stuttering is back but in different RPM range now. The inlet manifold was also replaced - 3 swirl flaps were gone!
Can anyone suggest any other areas to look at? Should a new EGR need blanking?
Symptoms are:
Stuttering/coughing when accelerating gently through certain RPM ranges. Once it's through, you get a bit of a kick as you overcome what feels like a blockage of some type.
The stuttering never occurs when the engine is cold - it only occurs after the temp gauge is close to its normal operating temp.
You can hear a chopping/swishing noise accompanying the engine stutter
The turbo gauge doesn't really seem to affected (could still be connected to turbo though?)
This doesn't cause any faults or EML

Any help would be greatly appreciated. I'm not sure I can afford to keep swapping out engine components
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Power Loss with Diesels: Guide

Might be worth investigating the MAF sensor, the engine runs a default map up until the engine reaches temperature, and yes, the car will still run better with a blanked EGR however old.
What rpm is the new stutter at?

Check the pipes don't have leaks too


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Cheers. Yeah the more I read about the MAF, the more likely it sounds. I'm going to give the car a few days to settle down and then un-plug the MAF, see if that sorts it.
EGR - that blows my mind!!!

The problem range has shifted slightly since the new components were fitted. It now affects acceleration from 1.25 RPM up to about 2.5 and there's another little stutter around 3. Sometimes its just a hiccup, sometimes its coughing and spluttering all the way through the whole range - It depends on throttle at the time. Before the new components, it used to be consistently close to 2 RPM in 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th.

This morning, I noticed the turbo gauge did drop during one of the big stutters. uh oh
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Not unusual this... There are numerous threads on this issue over the last 8 years I my experience don't waste time or money on the turbo control valve (the thing on the slam panel or MAP sensor, swirl valves. I have no egr, the removal of which can exaggerate this issue. MAF disconnection is next for me to try
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Right, over the weekend I had the EGR value blanked, DPF removed and remap carried out on my 2.4 Brera. The guy said that all went well but he seems my car is slightly underpowered until 2000 rpm compared to all the other Brera's that he has remapped, but it goes like stink as soon as you get above 2000rpm. There also seems to be some white smoke on start up so think it could be linked.. could it be an injector problem??

any idea what this could be before I start racking up sizeable bills just looking for the problem??
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