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Originally Posted by Brenton68 View Post
A worthwhile read, thankyou. Definitely something worth considering. Does the swirl flap delete with the EGR delete cure the dreaded stutter?
Stuttering and hesitation on a 159 1.9 16v JTDM was the start of this thread
http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-...e-159-1-a.html (Swirl flaps How To and MAF clean How To anywhere? 159 1.9)

It's a long, oily story. TL/DR: both Resolution's 159 and my 147 had detached swirl flaps and consequential damage, both now DIY fixed and running well. My EGR is deleted, his is restricted.
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Hey Brenton, North,Craigie. Red with white paint chips :-b, where are you?
Mike
Hi Mike
South in Oakford.
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Mr Muscle
Likely to corrode any aluminium like parts.

Don't
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Likely to corrode any aluminium like parts.

Don't
How many aluminium parts would you find on exhaust side in a turbo? ;-)
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How many aluminium parts would you find on exhaust side in a turbo? ;-)
Some people may want to spray it in the clogged intake side.
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Some people may want to spray it in the clogged intake side.
No, some people dont want to do that, because problem only is on exhaust-side where VGT is positioned....People that would do it on inlet side, could might as well spray it on the roof....Like with anything, if you got no clue about what your doing...DONT do it ;-)
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VGT clean.

i got under the car and managed to drown the VGT accuator with CRC. It didn't seem sticky before I lubed it. I then managed to get my hand to the mechanism, which seems to have a small longer rod to enable manual movement??!! I could move it and it seemed smooth enough but the spring is really strong and was really at the limit of using my finger to work the vane.
Is it meant to be so strong?

The first drive seemed better, but after 15 mins it was the same.

Regarding the boost sensor, how do I tell if it's playing up?

I've cleaned to little sponge by flicking it, wasn't really dirty.

Does anyone know if I can put pressurized air down any of this vacuum system to clean it? Are the little right angle connections on the back of the inlet manifold, the feeds for this system? Do they just venturi into the manifold??

Any thoughts??? anyone had this apart?

thanks in advance.
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It's really hard to check with finger pressure as the vacuum actuator acts as a strong spring that masks how free the VGT mechanism is or isn't. The only reliable way to check the VGT vanes aren't sticking is to test with a Mityvac (or cheap Chinese clone - ~15GBP on eBay) vacuum pump, connected to the actuator with a bit of hose. The actuator should move proportionately right back to the stop as you increase vacuum from 0-approx 18cm Hg (full range of the actuator is specced at 0-20cm Hg). This is about 2cm total movement at the lever end, not 1cm as eLearn states. If it jams and stops part way, or the movement isn't linear, the variable vane is sticking due to carbon and/or rust. Aerosol cleaners can deal with carbon, but not rust. It often is rust, just a tiny bit on the cast iron surface jams the moving vanes. Or, more rarely, at very high mileages you lose movement in wear to the VGT mechanism itself, within the turbo.

I think it's worth taking the turbo off and doing the job properly. It's then just 4 bolts to get inside the exhaust side of the turbo and clean it up and check for wear. It's also a good opportunity to check the general condition of the turbo impellers, seals and bearings. You have to detach the front cat from the turbo to use an aerosol and that is the hardest bit of removal anyway, thanks to the ferocious V-band clamp. If rust is the cause, you won't find out until you find it still sticks, so have to do it all again.

EDIT: and the vacuum used is created by the vacuum pump on the gearbox end of the cylinder head - the round, silver can thing, it's driven by exhaust cam rotation. It seldom goes wrong. What does very commonly go wrong is the vacuum pipe between the vacuum solenoid and the turbo vacuum actuator splits or develops tiny holes, that leads to lack of or erratic boost at low revs. Definitely the first thing to check, and it's a cheap and easy fix to replace (3mm ID silicone tube).

Last edited by halftone; 30-03-16 at 11:54.
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Thanks for all that, you've given me a little light at the end of the tunnel. I hope it's not an on coming train :-)
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.....the vacuum used is created by the vacuum pump on the gearbox end of the cylinder head - the round, silver can thing, it's driven by exhaust cam rotation. It seldom goes wrong.
I wondered what that was and how it works. Thanks.
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EGR Simulator has turned up, finally, after being stuck in Melbourne for about 2 weeks.

Will give this puppy a run on the week-end and see how it goes.
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OK, so I couldn't wait till the weekend so went out to the shed after dinner and fitted the EGR simulator and full blanking plate.

After hooking up the EGR Simulator I checked the ECU for errors of which there were two: One being that the MAF sensor had been disconnected and the other that the EGR had been disconnected. This was because the instructions say to turn on the ignition with the EGR disconnected and check the voltage with a volt meter on the two connecting pins on the EGR harness to make sure they are the right way round. It just so happened that I had the MAF sensor disconnected at that time also. So I used MultiECUscan to reset the errors.

Took the car for a run for about 45 mins, all different speeds and different loads. The good news is that there is now NO STUTTER. Zippo, Zilch, Nada. Drives like a dream. There is also no check engine light either. So I will continue to drive the car for another week then report back. Fingers crossed because so far so good.

Also, the wiring for the simulator comes in a proper harness now which is so much better than the photos on the Ebay advert.

The car still feels like that it has a "Power Band" when the revs hit 2.5 to 3k, but maybe they all feel like that? I don't know but it does feel good. Will report back in a week unless something happens before then.
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Regards

Brenton68

159 JTDM - 1.9L - Manual - Black

"I'm just here for the biscuits!"
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Good news! Give your map sensor a clean too ( I used EGR cleaner and sprayed a bit in the manifold too.



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I wondered what that was and how it works. Thanks.
That vacuum pump also makes vacuum for the brake servo, so if the servo is working well and the brakes aren't heavy, the pump is OK.
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Good news! Give your map sensor a clean too ( I used EGR cleaner and sprayed a bit in the manifold too.
Good tip, Thank you.

Almost wasn't going to bother as I had fitted a new MAP sensor less than 3,000km ago. However when I pulled it out, it was quite clagged up again, so cleaned it with a few shots of Brake clean.

If these things get clagged up so quickly with the EGR active (thankfully no loger a concern for myself), then how on earth can these sensors ever work properly in a standard system, even from when the cars were new?
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As I've said many times before, the EGR works well early on, but after a few thousand miles it really negatively affects car performance


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As I've said many times before, the EGR works well early on, but after a few thousand miles it really negatively affects car performance


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I had this cough on my 159 1.9 diesel. I cleaned the EGR valve and it made no difference. Since the EGR also incorporates an electrical solenoid I suspected this had failed. I bought a new EGR from Ebay at a very reasonable price and it cured the stutter immediately. Done 3000 miles on the new EGR and there have been no issues whatsoever.
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Hey Brenton68,
I'm looking at attacking the Turbo.
As far as I can tell I have to remove the exhaust manifold to remove turbo, I'm keen to clean that side, after watching that youtube VGT clip from the above posts.

Do any of the knowledgeable guru's reading this have any advice for me before I start??
thanks in advance :-0
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Hi Gbymb

Can't help you on R&R of the turbo, haven't been down that path as yet.

Good news is that after fitting the EGR simulator, the car is still purring nicely.
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Well , decided not to attack the turbo, but pulled the egr again and made the valves seal perfectly. By literally blowing from the exhaust side. Then pulling on the actuator and turning the arm about 20 degrees to seat the valves closer until it seals. With the solenoid off. Then lightly oiled the solenoid and valve arm. The first drive was bueatiful, but it's back to about 50% of what it used to be , an improvement I guess. Then the retaining clip on the connector broke. It's now cable tied up tight.
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Morning all

So Brenton, following your success I ordered a gadget off EBay and having waited a few extra days while Sydney tried to diffuse it and then realised it wasn't, in fact, anything harmful I received it this morning. Long weekend coming up and although I've got a fair bit on, I'm planning to save a few hours on Saturday/Sunday to get this thing onboard.

Fingers crossed!
Cheers
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Morning all

So Brenton, following your success I ordered a gadget off EBay and having waited a few extra days while Sydney tried to diffuse it and then realised it wasn't, in fact, anything harmful I received it this morning. Long weekend coming up and although I've got a fair bit on, I'm planning to save a few hours on Saturday/Sunday to get this thing onboard.

Fingers crossed!
Cheers
Yes, mine was stuck in Melbourne for nearly two weeks. Frustrating when something travels half way around the world in 2 days but then sits and waits in the destination country until someone has time to look at it.

Hopefully it all works well for you. I take it that you have the EGR blanking plate as well.

My car has been going so well since fitting the EGR simulator. The kms between DPF regens has also increased by 50-75% also, so maybe the EGR/stuttering etc was adding to the soot loads.

Do you have a licensed version of MultiECUScan? During the install, the instructions say to unplug the EGR and then test the pin voltage in the harness connector with the ignition on to be sure that the pins are the right way around. On mine, they were exactly as per the instructions, but having the ignition on with the EGR disconnected did throw a check engine light which I simply cleared with MultiECUScan.

After inserting the Simulator connecting pins into the EGR harness connector, I taped it all up with leccy tape just to keep any moisture out.

The whole job will only take about 10 minutes.

Good luck with it all and I hope that it fixes your issues.
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Hi Brenton

Just finished the installation. Yep, the hard part was fitting the 2 gaskets and the blanking plate on the underside of the EGR housing. I moved the expansion tank a little which gave enough room to get at all the stuff that had to be removed to get at the bolt heads for the EGR pipe. Before that though, I installed the gizmo and checked the voltage. As you found, the 10v was on the lower left and 3v on the lower right. I connected it and started the engine with no resulting warnings. I have a registered version of multiecu scan as part of the long story of trying to fix this issue but so far, I haven't needed to clear anything which was a bonus. I took it for a 20 minute ride and not only did it start and idle like a dream, it ran without fault. It's a different car altogether, it's quieter, smoother and drives so well. I also taped up the exposed socket and 2 wires with electrical tape and bound the plug to the nearest loom to support it and not let the pins support the socket. They looked like they may pull out over time so was extra cautious. I will find some heat shrink and tidy that end up when I get a chance.

Thank you Brenton for being the test pilot and taking the time to leave your feedback. Time will tell if it's a permanent cure and on it's next oil change/intermediate non essential service, I'll get an emissions test done by a local understanding mechanic (who is very interested in the solution). However, feedback from the UK is that the emissions with and without the EGR active both resulted in passes for an MoT yearly inspection.

I do believe this is the solution and if anyone is experiencing these symptoms, I wholeheartedly support trying this out. I will report back the emissions results for a little closure.

Thanks again, I owe you a beer or two if you're ever in Brisbane.

Cheers
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Hi Britswiss

Really glad to hear that it has been a success for you. I've probably done a couple thousand kms now since fitting the EGR simulator and hasn't missed a beat. Be interested if your mechanic picks up anything different in the emissions. Unless he can test for NOX I suspect that he won't notice anything different. It's also comforting to know that there is no longer soot recycling around the Turbo and Inlet manifold. I'm not sure why, but the kms between DPF regions on my vehicle has also extended. Maybe the stutters and driving it on the edge of stuttering (I'm sure you know what I mean) creates more soot, therefore clogs the DPF earlier.

Anyway, enjoy your "New" vehicle.
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Guys, when you say it's a new car, do you find its got a more constant acceleration curve? Or is it power? Or is it something else....I'm wondering if an 'egr delete' gives the same results. Or is it the ease of fixing and cost of doing it which sold you both.. or....thanks for humouring me....
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