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(Post Link) post #1 of 16 Old 25-05-12 Thread Starter
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Air con problems

Hi all.

When we finally get the warm nice summer temperatures in Norway the air con in my 08 159 1,9 jtdm starts blowing only warm air

Have done some trouble shooting and found that the air con compressor will not start/kick in. Checked the relay and fuse in the fusebox in the engine compartment and the fuse in the fusebox inside the car, all is OK. Then I found that the relay in the engine compartment fusebox don't get the earth/negative signal. I connected a separate wire from the batteri negative to the relay and the compressor starts working and nice cold air flows out of the air vents.

Anyone got a wiring diagram of the 159 they can share with me?

I'm thinking there is a broken wire somewhere, or the air con control don't work as it should?

Any other suggestions?

PS: it was regassed and checked with a diagnostic tool as the garage today. No messages.

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I take it the display still works ?
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Aircon is designed not to work if refrigerant level falls below a predetermined level. It could be that the method of this prevents the signal to the relay?
I'd start with the simple things, get the level checked.
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(Post Link) post #4 of 16 Old 25-05-12 Thread Starter
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Level checked - refilled/regassed today.
Display, buttons and lights on control unit inside car working.
Outside temperature sensor works.
If set to "High" or 32 degrees the air from the vents get even hotter.
When I connect a separate wire so the relay gets the "earth" signal everything is normal and works like it should.
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Now that it's regassed does it engage the clutch to the aircon pump???
Have you tried getting FES to see if you have any fault codes.
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(Post Link) post #6 of 16 Old 25-05-12 Thread Starter
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I really need to practice my english vocabulary...
Engage was the word I was looking for earlier.

The air con pump/compressor will not engage, but is engages when I connect the extra wire so that the air con pump relay (located in the engine compartment fusebox) connects to earth/minus.

The garage that did the refill of the air con system thinks there is a broken wire somewhere... Sounds expensive!
They connected their diagnostic tool, but there was no fault codes.

I have done some research, I downloaded the e-learn manual. Will do more research on that.

What I was wondering was if any of you have had any similar problems?
And if your problems was due to a broken wire, where was the broken wire located?
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I have the same problem, although I have not connected the earth to the relay yet as I do not have a volt meter to hand and have yet to identify the relay. I have however connected FES up and checked the relay from the actuator menu from the engine ECU whereby I can hear the relay clicking. When activating the relay from the climate control menu I do not get a relay click or any diagnostic trouble codes.

Without checking e-learn I am sure that activation of the aircon (clutch) pump is controlled by the engine management EDC as it is a pre-requisite that the cooling fans are activated as part of the cooling process which is under control of the EDC. Can you confirm if your cooling fan activates when the aircon is activated with and without the earth wire to the battery?

I suspect that your problem is the same as mine in that the engine management EDC is not communicating with the aircon through the CAN bus so do not start pulling the wiring apart without checking with FES through the EDC activation menu (if you have it) or through the garage.

I will be investigating further if I find anything I will post it (or if anyone else has experienced this perhaps they could reply).
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(Post Link) post #8 of 16 Old 28-05-12 Thread Starter
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Thanks for the input longclose.
The cooling fan runs as it should.

Will do some more searching and measuring before I tear the wiring looms apart....

elearn says the button (ice symbol) switches on the air cooling and dehumidification circuit, activating the air conditioning compressor, but the compressor activation is also depending upon activation of:
- the linear sensor, that locks air conditioner activation if coolant pressure is too low or too high.
- the engine control unit that excludes compressor operation in accordance with engine managment mode (high engine temp og load).

Got a tip regarding the linear sensor. One guy I talked to had changed a couple of these sensors because of the same problems. the sensor is K120 on drawing.

The relay is located in the engine bay fuse box. There are symbols inside the fuse box lid that shows which relay is for the compressor. It is interesting to know if you can activate the compressor in your car when connecting the relay to earth.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Compressor engagement.jpg (50.6 KB, 114 views)

Last edited by Ringom; 28-05-12 at 18:45.
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Well with failing eyesight and checking the wrong bl**dy fuse, I went through the whole diagnostic procedure. No DTC's on either engine management or climate control. I did identify the whole process though. After checking connections all the way through I identified a blown fuse (F19)doooh... (eyesight) its still blowing but is marginal so I am still investigating the reason why.

It looks like Ringom that you have the e-learn pack from your last posting so diagnostics should not be a problem. It makes life so much easier if you have a registerd FES (FiatEcuScan) package and dongle as you can operate the compressor clutch relay from software to prove the wiring. The signal from the climate control is recieved on pin 54 on the EDC, I am not sure if this is a CAN line or just a signal line. However if it is just an earth then hopefully with a multimeter you can see a change of state (I suggest it is). The whole compressor clutch engagement and control of the aircon (cooling fans) is operated by the EDC as long as pin 54 state is in the right condition as defined by the climate control (I am assuming you do not have a manual system?).

It crossed my mind that a DTC check may of only happened on the EDC and not on the climate control as this requires other inputs to engage AC.

I am happy to continue giving help but suggest pin 54 on the EDC as the starting point if all else looks OK as ther may be a wring fault between M070 (climte control unit) and M010 through connectors D021 and D001. MO70 activates on pins 15 & 17 on dual zone systems and again I am guessing this is an earth line.
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Forgot to mention that I think K120 failure would I hope raise a DTC in the EDC. Also pin 29 is the output from the EDC if pin 54 is changing state so look here for an earth on change of state of pin 54.
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(Post Link) post #11 of 16 Old 08-06-12 Thread Starter
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A short newsflash:

I drove the car for the first time in 9 days this morning (been on holiday in Spain), and now the aircon is working as it should. Which is nice :-)
I have tested it several times today and everything works as it should.

Will have to wait until it stops working again before I can do some more testing...
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Warning engine wiring harness shorting out...

After analysis found the problem. F19 (Aircon Comp Clutch) was replaced but kept blowing when on the move only! Found the issue .... removed engine cover and found main engine wiring harness was rubbing against the engine lifting eye when changing gear. Insultaion tape wrapped harness moved a little... nice cool air... apart from the sun no longer shines in the UK.

I have changed the title as this may affect other parts of the harness injectors etc.. hope this helps someone!
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(Post Link) post #13 of 16 Old 23-06-12 Thread Starter
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I complained to the company that sold me the car and they have done some problem searching. They say that they have located the problem, the control panel inside the car. New parts on order, hopefully getting them next week.

Fingers crossed...

By the way:

Longclose - Can you tell me where you found the main wiring harness was rubbing? When standing in front of car: Upper or lower left or right?
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(Post Link) post #14 of 16 Old 10-07-12 Thread Starter
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Air con problems FIXED

Problem solved.

It was the control panel inside the car that was the problem.
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alfa 159 1.9 jtdm ti will a vauxhall vectra air con pump fit my car ???

Hi i have a 1.9 jtdm 159 ti 09 plate model i have only had the car a few weeks and the air conditioning pump has an internal leak i have tried to source one
to find they are very very expensive even a reconditioned one are £350 a friend has told me that a pump from a vauxhall vectra should fit i have looked at pictures of both pumps and they do seem to be identical ??? so my question is is he right ??? vectra pumps are readerly avilable and a fraction of of an alfa pump many thanks to any member who can help me find the answer
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