Originally Posted by Philly
i was looking at getting a 2.0 147 in the summer but i didnt realise the 1.9 JTD M-Jet is actually quicker (0-62) and with a remap (+35) it would be taken up to around 185 bhp. So i've got a few questions for all you JTD owners and anyone else whos "in the know"
Please bare in mind i'm a bit of a noob when it comes to cars.
1 - Does it sound like a van? i mean does it sound like your average diesel, when starting up, when being rev'd, how loud is it etc.
2 - Does the heavy engine effect performance, as in handling.
3 - Is the turbo upgradable, if so what one, how much bhp would i see increased etc.
4 - How good is the JTD engine, is it reliable, are there any known problems etc.
sorry for all the questions, i just want to be sure i make the right choice
As you may be aware from my alias...I drive a 147 JTD 16V!
I love the car and the engine. Just bear in mind though that the 2.0's can be purchased as low as £12,000 for a 5dr Lusso BRAND NEW with LEATHER! Whereas the lowest I have seen the JTD 16V's for is around £15,000. So, there is a significant cost difference between the two.
I tow so I NEED the torque (not that the 2.0 is useless, just not as good). However, if I did not tow there is no doubt in my mind that I would have probably gone for the 2.0 instead. Frankly, as much as I love the JTD, I'm doubtful if it actually warrents the extra money required to purchase it.
If you also do lots of miles, it could be worth streching to it as the diesel will pay itself back within 5 years.
Resale values are better with the JTD as its more attractive second hand, so it will not depreciate as much as the 2.0.
As Sandys mentions, the 147 is a very heavy car for its size so the JTD not only performs well on paper, but also in real life unless you drive like a nutter all the time.
You also do not have problems with the Actuators going on the JTD's and generally the diesel will outlive and be more reliable than its petrol counterpart.
As for your questions:
1). It does sound gruff (not rough) when on initial starts in the morning. Not being adjacent to walls helps lower the noise levels! It is not loud though by any means. Its adequate I'd say. When its warm it just sounds a little rougher than a petrol at tickover and when your driving it just sounds sweet - very quiet.
This is what I love about the car that when poodling along cruising its VERY grown up - the masses of sound proofing which Focuses etc do not have gets rid of the road, wind and engine noise very well.
When you plant your foot on the throttle you get a gruff purr from the engine and it gets loud in a nice way.
2). The engine does feel heavy compared to the 1.6 TS I drove, but then it would
. I cannot comment on the 2.0 as I have never driven it. The steering and double wishbone front suspension works very well with the heavy front end. Remember that the rear of the 147 is heavy too, so having a heavy front end is not too stressful on the handling. The main problem is bottoming out (which is much the same with the other variants of petrol and diesel). This is a problem down to the poor springs dampers which as Sandys Alfa use take them off and gets some proper ones, but do not forget to tell the insurance company.
3). I would not bother about having the turbo uprated, especially after a remap - the fact of the matter remains that the chassis is not very good in the 147/156/GT range so putting lots of heavy torque AND power through it is not a very good idea! I think the clutch and gearbox would be subject to too power and torque too.
4). The block of the engine is a well proven unit. It dates back many years - not a bad thing really! Its even much the same as the 8v JTD in use today. The cylinder head is totally new though and with the oldest of cars only coming up to 3 years old (like mine) its too early to really tell. The only concerns I have for the future is the multijet technology which seems sophisticated and complex compared to the unijet technology in the 8v unit. As of yet though, I do not think that there are many serious problems. Most problems with 147's in general are caused by electrical glitches which again are hit and miss. Nothing more sever here though than a Pug mind!
Anyway....hope this helps!
BTW - brakes are hit and miss. Some are good some are bad - very bad.