a lot of good points being made here, but are we sure that Diffs, maps, blanking plates etc etc are all part of the shopping list?
cos if they aren't, then we're a tad off topic at the mo! ha ha!
having said that, i couldn't ever see myself in a car like this without the leather, so the cloth 1.9 would be off my wish list immediately.
for sure try both, but in all honesty, if you drive a 20v Ti, then get into a cloth 1.9, i think i can guess your reaction, and the price difference, even if quite substantial, will fade into negligence....
if the belts, pump, tensioners have all been done, that has just saved you a small fortune for starters, so thats well worth considering offset agaisnt the price of as car that will need them doing in the next year or so.
if the 20v Ti is reasonably priced in the first place, and you find little to nothing wrong with it, i'd be surprised if you don't fall in love with it.
that said, as everyone has shown here, and thats what the forum is all about eh, all the models and variances are great cars, there really isn't a bad choice amongst them, so i cant recommend enough trying as many models as you can to see what suits your driving style and uses.
but the facts are that they are all very good performers, they are all within a few mpg of each other if driven appropriately with that in mind, so for me it would come down to spec, condition, value for money, and personally i would like the performance side of things over other ares, so a 10v or 20v would be top of my shopping list to begin with.
nothing worse than being next to another similar car and wondering "why have i got the small one" ha ha!
the points made about the cheaper, but tweaked, 10v are very very true, they are a stonking car that responds incredibly well to all manner of tuning and modifying, and yes the fiat box is a better box than the gm, depending on what angle you want to come from really though, because like i said before, if you won't be looking to bolt on diffs etc, there is little else to effectively make the gm box substantially less desireable, and it wouldn't limit my shopping list accordingly.
all the jtd's respond very well to improved exhaust flow and good quality mapping, but that said, there is always this to consider.
(blimey this is turning into a right essay, i hope i'm not boring folk!)
ALL the jtd's, right from the early lower powered units respond so well to map work and other supporting mods that they can ALL produce stunning drives, whilst still returning very very good mpg, a great and clever package, all of them, but without bottomless budget, the limiting factor becomes the clutch which will give out pretty quickly once you're exceeding much above 300ftlb of torque, and the gearbox's, including the fiat unit, won't like sustained torque exceeding about 350ftlb.
am i somewhere near Pud?
so a 2.4 20v being quite a bit closer to these figures in the first place, it is a much cheaper car to improve on, one decent map will have you rocketing around, within safety, and as far as you should take it without threatening anything that is gonna cost more than you have in the rainy day fund!
now an early 1.9 8v will do this too, but it makes sense that to achieve similar you might have to work a little harder, and spend a bit more money, and you are stretching it by a much larger % of it design output than you would the bigger motors, so stands to reason that other area's may suffer sooner too.
but they will all do 200+bhp and produce enough ftlb to break their own gearbox if modified enough/inappropriately,
so another vote for the 10/20v i reckon, with mild, cheaper, and sensible mods, if you so desire.
and who doesn't like the sound of a five cylinder on boost through a bit of open pipework, its fab, i miss my 10v dearly for that alone!
Last edited by PETR0LHEAD; 20-11-11 at 20:51.