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(Post Link) post #51 of 101 Old 08-06-08 Thread Starter
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Forgot to say, the clutch I got doesn't actually fit onto the DMF - the holes don't line up. The problem I have is that I don't know if it's the clutch that's wrong or my DMF that's wrong.

Hopefully my nightmare will end shortly when I get the driveshaft and replace it.

Cheers,

Mark
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Thanks for the very comprehensive description of your problems Mark. It sounds like you have got to the bottom of the problem alright, I'm fairly confident now that that's been the problem for all of us that have been following this thread. Let us know how the new driveshaft works out, and then all we'll have to do is work out which driveshaft to replace.....
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Hi,

I think I may have the same problem with my car. I am getting vibrations in 5th / 6th gear at low revs. When in 3rd/4th car seems fine when 3000 onwards.

Strange thing is if turning left the car and accelerating (on a fast bend) the car is very smooth.

I have had a look in the history and have reciepts for driveshafts at (I think) 60k. The mileage is just over 97k now.

Question for the Mark_JTD (and other people) that had the same problem: with this fault, is the vibration felt through the steering wheel?

The vibration seems to be from the power deliverey from my car and not felt through the steering.

It sounds exactly the same as Mark_JTD's problem. Was it the whole driveshaft that needed to be changed as I am not sure what you did exactly. Its eems to be the grease in the shaft, or was it the driveshaft or the Flange?

Thanks for your help.

04 156 2.4 JTD SW Veloce

Last edited by Shaz; 13-06-08 at 15:14.
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

i wonder if the torque is too much for the shafts on the 20v
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Well mines a 10v and its vibrating away merrily, though after reading this thread, http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/alfa-...el-judder.html, I'm even more confused as to what the problem may be. Jesus, never a dull moment with these tempermental Italian beauties, and I don't mean the women........
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

I've just been out on a drive during lunch and it doesn't seem as bad as last night.

There is definitely a vibration there though. It is more pronounced in 5th/6th when you put your foot down. Also seems present in 4th too.

If I accelerate hard in 2nd up to 4500 rpm it is smooth (maybe only a slight hint of vibration).

I wander if its a deformed tyre or something as the rear tyres are getting on a bit, and O/S does lose about 6-8 psi after 3 weeks, whist the other three are steady.

I hadn't noticed during daily drive as the A roads to word are quite bumpy anyway.

I only noticed whist driving on a dual carriageway. I had noticed on the motorway a few months ago, but the next day the vibration had disappeared.

I know my antiroll bar bush is knocking (I think that’s causing the clonk) as I had Alfa Tecnico have a look at the wishbones etc whilst in for a service a few months ago, and they found some play in the Anti roll bar. Wishbones seemed ok.
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

I had changed the complete driveshaft on the passengers side(made no difference), but just the outer(bit that goes through the hub) on the drivers side. The drivers side seems to be made up of 3 sections, the outer shaft(bit through the hub), the inner shaft(middle section with the spider on it(3 little bars sticking out with roller/ring bearings on)) and then the cup shaft(me making up the name!!) that connects to the gearbox(that the spider sits in which is triangular up).

Sounds exactly the same as mine to be honest. There is vibration on the steering wheel, but I can't really say where it is specifically through the wheel as it seems to be the front endof the car as a whole. I was supprised how bad it actually is from just being a drive shaft. I just worked some grease into the roller bearings after the shaft/spider was out of the cup when I changed the wishbones. It made a massive difference and completely changed the way the car felt and drove, it's just a shame the garage put a jubilee clip on instead of a proper clip and it lost all the grease again.

I'm going to attempt to do the same thing again tomorrow to the ring bearings and see if I can save myself £125 or so on getting the new driveshaft(as it virtually fixed it for a week as I did this last time). The place I am looking at to get the driveshaft from is here if I need to replace in the end is Car Parts Direct I've not used them before but it's £125 for the shaft and a £50 charge which is refundable when you send your old shaft back. I'm going to give them a bell tomorrow to try and ascertain if it's the complete shaft for £125 or just a section. From the way it's written on the site it sounds like it's the complete shaft(outer and inner) as it doesn't specify inner or outer shaft on the order form. Hopefully this should be easier to replace as it's just the hub nut to remove and the wishbone balljoint to pop out(easier than it sounds I know!!).

Shaz, that is almost exactly the same as mine. Upwards of 3500rpm the vibration virtually goes. If I accelerate from a standstill up to something like 100mph on my private road, nothing there, its only when I'm in a high gear and accelerate from low revs that it's at its worst. There is also the issue with turning the wheel at roundabouts/bends/changing lanes on the motorway etc which initially made me think it was a wheel bearing, but greasing though roller bearings on the driveshaft sorted all of it out. Try putting the front wheels on the back and the back wheels on the front to see if that improves anything.

I'll give an update again tomorrow after I've had another play about and also when I've spoken to carparts direct.

Do you have a proper alfa clip on the runner boots on the driveshafts or zipties/jubilee clips or any sign of grease from it leaking previously?!

I think mine must have leaked at some point and the garage/previous owner just put on a ziptie to pass an mot or something I assume?! The problem seemed to just get worse over a month or so with no one touching the car apart from me. It must have been like it for at least 3 or 4 months and about 6-8k miles before the vibration started, so I assume what little grease was in there disappeared somehow, but there is no sign of the rubber boot actually leaking at all or any splits.

Cheers,

Mark
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Thanks for the update.

I have driven the car and it is a lot better than before. There is a slight vibration (steering wheel is fine nothing felt through this) and again it is the sensation of a wheel wobble - very slight - can actually feel it in 2nd gear now too.

I have also tried to coast in neutral and again there is a hint of the wobble, so hopefully I may have been lucky and have an issue with a wheel or tyre.

I may try swapping the wheels, and if I feel it through the steering, then I will know that it is one of the wheels.

Thanks for the driveshaft info is very helpful, as there is still a possibility it could be this.

Thanks again.
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Another update:

The problem on mine has reappeared and is worse than before, in that it is not intermittant now. Also when turning left there is a grumble sound (faster right bends, or roundnabouts).

It definately is exactly as Mark_JTD described his problem. A local mechanic took a quick test drive on Friday night and confirmed it feels like the driveshaft. I have dropped it off this morning for him to have a look at (didn't have a ramp/lift spare on Friday, so was unable to look at it).
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Just got back and its worse than I thought...
Both driveshafts have play in them.

The car has had both driveshafts replaced, when I looked by the previous owner (company car), about 18 months ago. I phoned the last garage - CloverLeaf in Gloucster, and he remembers the car. It had both driveshafts changed for a vibration. - (Same issue now).

What could cause them both too fail so soon - not sure what the mileage was when they were last changed, but estimating that they only lasted 20k - 25k Max.


Any ideas? Has anyone changed their drive shafts - and have you had any trouble since?
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

just following up on my own posts in the this thread!

i had the same issues as the OP.

got my driveshaft replaced yesterday (left side) and the car is now driving perfectly again. long story short - it seems quite tricky for garages to diagnose the problem, they usually just put it down wheels, balancing etc.
I found a good mechanic in galway who diagnosed the problem from the diagnosis of the vibrating/shaking and confirmed it after a short drive.

I replaced the upper wishbones as well and the ride is much better.

1 or 2 small things to still to do but now its a pleasure to drive again.
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Sounds exactly like the issue I had, which turned out to be driveshaft related (tri-axles and cups).

See related discussion
http://www.alfaowner.com/Forum/engin...ml#post1991836

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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Thanks for the update charliescraper, mine needs looking at too.
Did you need to replace the driveshaft too?

Whereabouts are you, and who did you use?
Also where did you sort the parts from?

Thanks
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Just the tri-axles and bearing cups. I'm in Bristol. You could always give Duncan at Alfanet a call, irrespective of where you are. He did the work, top guy 07968 488942. I'm sure he'd be happy to give you advice.

Cheers
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Thanks - I will do. I'am guessing this is the same as the Flange Mark_JTD had changed on his.
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Yup, I think that's the correct name for what I referred to as the 'inner cup' the centre section of driveshaft sits in.

Cheers,

Mark
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Mark/Charlie, to try and finally put a name to the parts you are talking about, could you take a look at the pictures in this link (its from the eper parts catalogue) and identify the 'triaxles and bearing cups',
regards,
Hugh.

http://eper.fiatforum.com/eper/navi?ENGINE_NO=3492381&MOD_COD=116&MVS=116.947.1.0 .0&MONTH=02&COUNTRY=012&GRP_COD=274&COLOUR=168_1_2 _3_4&VERSION=4&SIN_ENGINE=841C000&CAT_COD=X1&SIN_V ERSION=932BXC00&YEAR=2003&SBMK=R&CHASSIS_NO=013187 36&SELECTED_COLOR_COMB=060|080|168|664&ENGINE=30&D RIVE=S&VEHICLE_NO=00542641&MAKE=R&COMM_MODEL=156&A LL_FIG=0&LANGUAGE=3&PREVIOUS_KEY=PARTDRAWDATA&ALL_ LIST_PART=0&SB_CODE=-1&KEY=PARTDRAWDATA&PRINT_MODE=0&EPER_CAT=SP&GUI_LA NG=3&WINDOW_ID=1&SGRP_COD=2&SGS_COD=4&DRW_NUM=1
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(Post Link) post #68 of 101 Old 18-08-08 Thread Starter
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

The part number is 46307865 and it's just called shaft or Differential Shaft on my eper. But it's more of a cup in my opinion.

I tried uploading the picture from eper, but it won't let me at work. I'll try it later.

edit; ooh, it did work - part number 4, long one for drivers side, short one for passengers.

Cheers,

Mark
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

One thing to be aware of with this sort of thing. If the gaiters split the grease comes out onto the wheel rim. This can settle in on place when you stop and it all cools down and can pick up loads of dirt. The wheel ballance goes all to pot. Hence the terrible vibrations. Clean of the inside of the wheels before you go off buying new driveshafts. You may only need new gaiters.
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark_JTD View Post
The part number is 46307865 and it's just called shaft or Differential Shaft on my eper. But it's more of a cup in my opinion.

I tried uploading the picture from eper, but it won't let me at work. I'll try it later.

edit; ooh, it did work - part number 4, long one for drivers side, short one for passengers.

Cheers,

Mark
i had to change part 1b on mine as well.
i thought it was called a spider bearing but my alfa disc calls it a 3 lobe joint.
the spider bearing failed causing movement in the shaft. this caused the vibrating, and damaged part 4 in the other pic.

hope this helps
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Confusion sorted, I had been looking for triangular bits (Toblerone anyone) but mine is a different set up to yours as you can see from picture. No triangles, just round bits, now I just got to figure out which bit is wonky. So Alfa can't get round or triangular joints to handle the torque of the 2.4, 10v or 20v, maybe they should try square ones...... Thanks for your help guys, will update when I finally get to the bottom of my vibration,
regards.
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

So what's the issue with your driveshafts at the moment, have you replaced them or anything?

I've got one of those driveshafts in your pic at home if you needed one. Car parts direct sent me the wrong one initally and never collected it.

Cheers,

Mark
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Mark, thank you very much for the kind offer of assistance. I have a vibration which i'm certain is driveshaft related but I haven't had it checked properly yet (hate going near the garage and hate being without the car while they work on it), so just doing as much research as possible before thereby reducing the time off road. When I know more I'll get back to you, but if yours doesn't have an alfa part number it may be impossible to identify which model it fits as there are many different types. Thanks again,
Hugh.
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Right - finally going to attempt to solve this as I am having my lower wishbones and drop links replaced, and the vibration is really bad now.

Took it to another garage (not an alfa specialist, but decent guy recomended at work by a colleague). He has had a look, says the n/s (passenger) driveshaft boot is torn and the grease has leaked out, closer to the gearbox end. He has said a replacement is shaft needed as it looks worn. If the 1st (local) garage had told me this, would have saved time.

Hopefully it is just this side that is worn, as it vibrates more when turning right, or going round a roundabout, or moving from left lane to the middle / right lanes in a motorway, and is completley smooth turning the other way).

So my questions are:

1:Looking at the diagrams above, are both sides driveshafts (passenger and drivers side)the same as in the diagrams in MArk_JTD's and Mickc posts, or is it only one side that has the 3 prod triaxle thingy in the image?

2: If I buy a complete drive shaft from here:
http://www.carparts-direct.co.uk/dri...fts_detail.cfm

Is the triaxle thingy part of this, and is the cup part of this as it is complete?

Here hoping I don't need two shafts and two cups.

P.s. Mark-JTD do you have the part numbers from Car parts direct - so I can avoid them giving me the wrong one, seeing as there are so many versions!
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Re: Very bad vibrations....

Anyone?
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