156 V6 suspension replacement for increased comfort - Page 2 - Alfa Romeo Forum
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There is definitely adjustment for the rear, toe is adjustable. You need proper 4 wheel tracking, your average mechanic won't have the gear for that. A good tyre company would. Google your area. Settings should be 0 front and I think 3 for the rear. Alfa sportpack setting.
Don't dismiss the shocks yet. They could still be a crap brand.
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A friend of mine who drives the same car with full stock configuration is going to give the measurements from wheel centre to wings, so we'll know if the lowering is excessive or not.

Here is the geometry report: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B5X...ew?usp=sharing.
"Avant Gauche" = Front left
"Avant Droite" = Front right
"Arričre Gauche" = Rear left
"Arričre Droite" = Rear right
"Carrossage" = Camber
"Chasse" = Pull
"Para." stands for Parallčlisme (same word as English, obviously).

In the tables, "avant" stands for 'before [adjustment]' and "actuel" stands for 'after [adjustment]', while "zone correcte" lists the range of corrections which Alfa recommends for sport kit chassis.

They used a proper 4-wheels adjustment bench, but the tyre fitter told me that he was unable to act on the adjustment bolts enough to bring back the camber in the recommandation. He didn't found the camber bolts for the rear, so he hasn't touched anything here.
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Camber isn't adjustable.
The only adjustment is toe front & rear.
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After years of messing with Camber, I have found anything more negative then -1.40 causes inner wear.

I had mine at -1.35 toe set at 0.00 at the front and the tyres lasted as they should. Ensure they adjust the sub frame to centre to get equal camber, as David said it is not adjustable.
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On that French printout, "Para" is Toe.
So ok on the front, but rear toe needs looking at.
Could just be the adjuster bolts blocked up with years of dirt, but could also be bent linkages or the long bolt bent.
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So you have same measurements with Eibach -30 and FSDs than me without FSDs?
OK, that is puzzling…

And you don't have problems as I do?

Does someone know what is the stock height?

About the wheel alignment, the tyre fitter told me that there is no available adjustment in the rear. I'll make a scan of the adjusment report.

But there is adjustment at the rear.
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Just to be sure, here is my check list:
- new dampers: Koni FSDs (do you know if I can find cheaper than Ł570?)
- check the springs to be sure, change for same model (Eibach -30 mm) if needed
- check sub frame at the front and linkages at the rear.

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After years of messing with Camber, I have found anything more negative then -1.40 causes inner wear.

I had mine at -1.35 toe set at 0.00 at the front and the tyres lasted as they should. Ensure they adjust the sub frame to centre to get equal camber, as David said it is not adjustable.
My tyre fitter said he wasn't able to bring back the camber under -2 because the adjuster bolts were already at max.

How should they adjust the sub frame?

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On that French printout, "Para" is Toe.
So ok on the front, but rear toe needs looking at.
Could just be the adjuster bolts blocked up with years of dirt, but could also be bent linkages or the long bolt bent.
All right, I will told him next time. The car will be checked by my mechanics next week anyway.
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Quote:
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My tyre fitter said he wasn't able to bring back the camber under -2 because the adjuster bolts were already at max.
Not sure what he is looking at, but there is no camber adjustment...
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Don't think you want to be fitting -30mm springs to FSD's. The pro kit is -15mm (I think) which is compatible with FSDs. Too low and the shocks will blow. - I am sure someone will correct me if I am wrong.
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Don't think you want to be fitting -30mm springs to FSD's. The pro kit is -15mm (I think) which is compatible with FSDs. Too low and the shocks will blow. - I am sure someone will correct me if I am wrong.
You might want to read the thread from the beginning.
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Thanks a lot, that will be helpful.
You have already advised to check about the dirt problem, but somehow I missed it… Sorry about that.
I'll check with my mechanic.

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Not sure what he is looking at, but there is no camber adjustment...
At the front, I am almost sure there is.

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Don't think you want to be fitting -30mm springs to FSD's. The pro kit is -15mm (I think) which is compatible with FSDs. Too low and the shocks will blow. - I am sure someone will correct me if I am wrong.
Pro-kit is -30 mm and Sportline is -50 mm. I have no idea how -50 can be fitted safely, though.
It has been advised to go with -30 while fitting FSDs because of the higher spring support on the front dampers. (But Hugh, with Eibach -30 and FSDs, seems to have same height as me, although I am pretty sure not to have FSDs already.)
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As standard, the only adjustment available on the front and rear of a 156 is toe. Camber is not adjustable.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sprint_veloce View Post
As standard, the only adjustment available on the front and rear of a 156 is toe. Camber is not adjustable.
Correct - only toe/tracking has any separate adjustment - although you can slacken the subframe and push it to the left or right to equalise out camber, if for example you have lots of negative on one side and close to zero on the other. Centralising the subframe equals out the camber. But you can't add negative camber to one side without reducing it on the other side.
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As standard, the only adjustment available on the front and rear of a 156 is toe. Camber is not adjustable.
Hm, OK. So do you think the camber values (~-2°) are normal given that the car is lowered?

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Correct - only toe/tracking has any separate adjustment - although you can slacken the subframe and push it to the left or right to equalise out camber, if for example you have lots of negative on one side and close to zero on the other. Centralising the subframe equals out the camber. But you can't add negative camber to one side without reducing it on the other side.
That would be helpful as rear camber is not symmetric (left rear: -2°28" ; right rear: -1°43").

Also thanks Pud237, because I wanted to send you a MP but I'm still not allowed to it.
Hugh advised me to buy new rear top mounts for dampers and told me that you may be able to sell me a couple.
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Hm, OK. So do you think the camber values (~-2°) are normal given that the car is lowered?


That would be helpful as rear camber is not symmetric (left rear: -2°28" ; right rear: -1°43").

Also thanks Pud237, because I wanted to send you a MP but I'm still not allowed to it.
Hugh advised me to buy new rear top mounts for dampers and told me that you may be able to sell me a couple.
-2 degrees at the front is about what you get with a lowered 156.

For the rear top mounts, have you got a saloon or SW model?
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-2 degrees at the front is about what you get with a lowered 156.
Hopefully, fitting FSDs will make the car slightly higher and therefore reduce the camber, right?

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For the rear top mounts, have you got a saloon or SW model?
It's a SW model from 11/2002. I can give you the chassis number if needed.
I am also looking for a couple other spare parts, especially a tricky one. Can you please give me an email to send you the list?
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Hopefully, fitting FSDs will make the car slightly higher and therefore reduce the camber, right?


It's a SW model from 11/2002. I can give you the chassis number if needed.
I am also looking for a couple other spare parts, especially a tricky one. Can you please give me an email to send you the list?
Hopefully the FSDs will lift it a little, but I'm not 100% sure what the score is with the shock shoulder height on the FSDs. I've got FSDs & Eibach Pro springs on my 156 JTD and its sitting exactly where I would expect it to, front and rear. Just a touch lower than my GTA which is on FSDs & std GTA springs.

My email is my username on here at gmail dot com.
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Hopefully the FSDs will lift it a little, but I'm not 100% sure what the score is with the shock shoulder height on the FSDs. I've got FSDs & Eibach Pro springs on my 156 JTD and its sitting exactly where I would expect it to, front and rear. Just a touch lower than my GTA which is on FSDs & std GTA springs.
Well then, in your opinion is it better to stick with Eibach Pro -30 or to go back on OEM springs?

I'm actually a little worried to see that Hugh's 156, with Eibach Pro & FSDs, sits exactly at same height than mine with Eibach Pro & unknown dampers.

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Thanks, I'll touch you ASAP.
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I'll touch you ASAP.
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I may have forgotten a few words. It's one recurring mistake and I don't always check. Too bad that it turns my sentence in a bad way this time.
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Well then, in your opinion is it better to stick with Eibach Pro -30 or to go back on OEM springs?

I'm actually a little worried to see that Hugh's 156, with Eibach Pro & FSDs, sits exactly at same height than mine with Eibach Pro & unknown dampers.
I think FSDs & Eibach Pro works really well on a 156. Its only on the GT where I've noticed the front sits higher than it should do. Koni spec the same shocks and Eibach spec the same springs. I've not seen any measurements taken of a Koni shock and an OEM GT shock to say for sure this is exactly the cause of the front end being raised.


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Thanks, I'll touch you ASAP.
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I think FSDs & Eibach Pro works really well on a 156. Its only on the GT where I've noticed the front sits higher than it should do. Koni spec the same shocks and Eibach spec the same springs. I've not seen any measurements taken of a Koni shock and an OEM GT shock to say for sure this is exactly the cause of the front end being raised.
Hmm OK.
I hope though that it will lift it sufficiently, or otherwise I'll have to refit OEM springs…

I have sent you an email, by the way.
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Hi everyone.

Almost everything is ready to fit the FSDs but one thing.
The front dampers need to be set and there is 3 different springiness settings: +180°, +360° and +720°. I never read anything about this when I was doing research about the FSDs.
My mechanic is tempted to choose the intermediate (360°) setting, while I tend to considere the softest (180°).
Do you know what to do?

By the way, he had looking the subframe and it seems full of dirt and gravels, potentially interfering with the toe bolts, like some of you advised me about. He will take care of this when fitting the dampers.
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I never heard of a stiffness setting on FSD's, mine were just fitted, interested in hearing what you find out. How do they adjust ? Is it possible to reset them when fitted to the car ?
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