GT 3.2 Gearbox replacement otions - Alfa Romeo Forum
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GT 3.2 Gearbox replacement otions

Hi Guys,

bought a lovely GT 3.2 - exceptional handling and fast as hell, but I have a problem with gearbox which previous owner "forgot" to mention.

When I drive calmly (not exceeding 3000 rpm) everything is OK and I can drive like this 100, 200 km no problem.

But as soon as I hit a gas and go fast, after few hundred meters, really loud metal knocking sounds apear somewhere under engine and they do not go away even if I stop the car. Only when I press the clutch, sounds disappear. That is why I think it is a failed gearbox.

I have a chance to buy very cheaply good gearbox from 1999 Alfa 166 3.0.

I know they should be almost identical. But can I expect any problems when swapping them?

Also - some 3.0 a 3.2 166's curiously have duall mass flywheel and some do not. My GT I assume does not have DMF. So if gearbox I am buying has DMF and my GT has not, would there be any problems with installation?

Thank you very much for help and excuse my poor english
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I believe the differential is usually the weak point in the drive train of the 3.2 V6... Swapping a diff is easier than a box for sure! Good opportunity to upgrade to a Quaife too!
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I believe the differential is usually the weak point in the drive train of the 3.2 V6... Swapping a diff is easier than a box for sure! Good opportunity to upgrade to a Quaife too!
Thank you I have read about weak diffs. I am planning to install Q2 or Quiafe next year as it is too much money for me right now. As a quick cheap fix I would swap the gearbox for another one. I can have it really cheap (80GBP) from my friend. I just need to know if it is going to fit allright.

Also, this might sound amateur, but where exactly is a diff on this car? Am I right to think that it is somewhere inside the gearbox? So when I change whole gearbox the diff will be changed as well?

Thanks
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you may do well to post this in the GTA section. The standard original differentials are prone to fail with the 3.2 engine....your set up is very similar to the 156 and 147 GTA set up.

The gearbox won't be affected by the type of flywheel. the ratios may be different for the 3.0 166...but the gearbox is basically the same thing.

However if your diff is on the way out....now is the time to change it.....often they fail with no warning and the explosion can damage the casing wall of the gearbox too.

Having siad that, a Quaife or Q2 type of differential will very much improve the car.
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The 3.0 166 box is all but identical. However, the diff housing is different. You'll need to use the one off the 3.2 gearbox. Make sure you use the dipstick out of the 3.2 gear box as they are different to account for the installation angle of the engine.

Use the 3.2 GT flywheel and clutch. The Flywheel is balanced with the crank and aux belt pulley for a start and the 3.0 DMF's are heavy / will fail.

Removing the gearbox from the GT will be hampered by access to the starter motor bolts - you can't get at one of them as the CF3 exhaust manifold is in the way.

I used a 3.0 166 gearbox on my 156 with a 3.2 GTA engine. Thead here;

http://forum.alfa156.net/forum/forum...2E0&PN=0&TPN=1
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And make sure it's not the clutch that's failed when you take it apart...
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And make sure it's not the clutch that's failed when you take it apart...
Thank you Chris! Very informative, exactly what I needed. And the conversion thread is great.

2 more questions.

1) Would you have a picture showing differnces between diff housings?
2) Are diffs identical in 166 3.0 and GT 3.2?

Thanks, very helpfull forum let me say
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Quote:
Originally Posted by liborl View Post
Thank you Chris! Very informative, exactly what I needed. And the conversion thread is great.

2 more questions.

1) Would you have a picture showing differnces between diff housings?
2) Are diffs identical in 166 3.0 and GT 3.2?

Thanks, very helpfull forum let me say
1) plenty of pics in the thread I linked too. The 166 housing lacks the mounting point for the rear engine mount on the gt.

2) the diffs are different. For a start I think the crown wheel may be a different ratio but you're stuck with using that as it has to match the gearbox's final drive.

In addition, either the sun or planet gears in the 3.2 diff are stronger. Can't remember if it's both or just one of the two. However they're not strong enough and do fail.

I would inspect the 3.2 diff very carefully before reusing it in the 3.0 box as it may be this that has failed. Fortunately, you don't have to drop the gearbox to swap the diff, so if you find the money in the future for a quaife or Q2 it's not another major job.
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Like Chris said, gearbox is the same, just the cover of diff is different. On gt the cover is used as a support for rear motor mount. On 166 there is no mount on the cover because the engine has it at the right driveshaft.
So you swap gearbox and use cover from your gearbox.

If you really want to make it bulletproof than go the torsen diff route
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Originally Posted by alan Q4+33 View Post
Like Chris said, gearbox is the same, just the cover of diff is different. On gt the cover is used as a support for rear motor mount. On 166 there is no mount on the cover because the engine has it at the right driveshaft.
So you swap gearbox and use cover from your gearbox.

If you really want to make it bulletproof than go the torsen diff route
Guys, you are great! I will buy the gearbox and will be swaping them next week. I'll let know results

For some reason my Ad blocker removed pictures from the 166 thread, but I can see them now perfectly, thanks.

One last thing and this may be due to the language barrier, but I do not fully understand the diff situation. I understand they are different, but Chriss said to be carefull when use 3.2 diff in 3.0 box. So it can be done? Despite the differences?
Contrary - can I use 3.0 diff in 3.2 gearbox if I find out that only the diff went wrong in my 3.2 GT?

Thank you very much.

ps: just out of pure curriosity, autolluso says on their website that gearbox in 1.9jtd GT and 147 1.9jtd is the same as in the V6's.. can I ask what would happen If I put one of these in my GT? (not planning to that
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Quote:
Originally Posted by liborl View Post

One last thing and this may be due to the language barrier, but I do not fully understand the diff situation. I understand they are different, but Chriss said to be carefull when use 3.2 diff in 3.0 box. So it can be done? Despite the differences?
Yes, they're the same basic unit. The 3.2 diff just has stronger internal gears.

Quote:
Originally Posted by liborl View Post

Contrary - can I use 3.0 diff in 3.2 gearbox if I find out that only the diff went wrong in my 3.2 GT?
Yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by liborl View Post
ps: just out of pure curriosity, autolluso says on their website that gearbox in 1.9jtd GT and 147 1.9jtd is the same as in the V6's.. can I ask what would happen If I put one of these in my GT? (not planning to that
Again, yes. Same as the 3.0, it's just the crown wheel that's different and that just bolts onto the diff.

ETA, thought you were talking about just the diffs... which are as my initial comment. The diesel gearbox itself is the same basic unit but there are wider differences.

Last edited by Chris155; 04-10-16 at 12:34.
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Firstly, you should stop driving it. For your cheap fix, fit the 166 gearbox with the diff cover from the GT 'box and it will be sorted. Then, if you've caught it early enough you might be lucky and be able to repair the GT gearbox with a Quaife or similar diff. But usually when one of the diff's spider gears breaks up it punches a hole in the gearbox casing into the bell housing and that's really the end of the box. Do you have the suspicious smell of gear oil leaking from the bell housing area?

All this assumes the diff is your problem, it might be something else, but probably not.

And many of the 156/147/GT diesel cars use the same type of gearbox as the V6 cars, but they're not actually the same as they have a different bellhousing to attach to the diesel engines, and different gear ratios to account for the fact that diesel engines have very different power and torque characteristics to a busso V6.
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(Post Link) post #13 of 13 Old 05-10-16 Thread Starter
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Thank you guys, I understand everything now.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sprint_veloce View Post
Do you have the suspicious smell of gear oil leaking from the bell housing area?
I did smell some burnt oil several times(do not know from where it was coming), but I did not thing it was related back then.. This is sad news. Does it mean my 3.2 box is completely done? I hoped I could repair it and put back when I buy Q2 diff.

OK, now I know it is really serious issue and will not drive that car until the box is changed.

And one last question: Pal who offers me 3.0 166 box also has 2.5 166 box and from pictures it looks in better shape then 3.0 box. Can you please comment on 2.5 box vs 3.0 box as a fix for my GT?

Thanks.
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