EOL fail - Alfa Romeo Forum
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(Post Link) post #1 of 11 Old 11-09-16 Thread Starter
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EOL fail

Hi,

my selespeed sometimes skipping 3rd gear (it Comes on and off).
when its happen i "feel" the delay and rpm goes up and down

i changed the back selespeed sensor and adjust the clutch on 28.3 (from 27.5)

the problem remain.

i tried to do EOL with FES but it fail when it start.

what do i do wrong?


thx for any help here,
Elad.
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Engine warm & foot on brake?
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(Post Link) post #3 of 11 Old 11-09-16 Thread Starter
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Engine warm yes, well foot on brake i didnt know i had to do.

FES doesnt say to do it but if you say ill try this way.

tnx 4 help!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by el@d147 View Post
...well foot on brake i didn't know i had to do.

FES doesnt say to do it but if you say ill try this way.
Are you sure it doesn't give a warning/instruction?
I'm sure it used to. The FIAT Examiner and AlfaDiag did.
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(Post Link) post #5 of 11 Old 11-09-16 Thread Starter
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Yes, iam sure
Take a look
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File Type: jpg EOL.jpg (94.2 KB, 12 views)
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You don't have to step on the brake pedal for EOL procedure. You have to do that for clutch drain though.
Did you go through clutch drain first? When did it fail during EOL calibration?
If the pump and associated electricals are not up to task, the pump may stop half way and the procedure will fail.
The pressure is all fine I presume?
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Ok

Yes you DO have to have your foot on the brake pedal, because what people don't realise is that the first thing an EOL does is ANOTHER Clutch Drain Sequence at the start of the Calibration! It used to frustrate the crap out of me when I first started working on Alfas & Selespeeds as the EOL would pass/fail randomly, till I realised when it passed it was because it just so happened at the time I had my foot resting on the brake.

When you say it "skips" 3rd gear, do you mean it drops to neutral or it hunts around for 3rd, can't seem to find it and skips the gear and selects 4th or 5th?

If it's the former check how long the Accumulator holds pressure for, if its the latter try retightening the "pinch bolt" to the correct torque. If it loosens the slightest it will cause it to have trouble getting past 3rd.

You can do an "Engagement lever pin test" which is another name for the "Pinch Bolt". If it fails, it's definitely loose, if it passes it could still be loose so check it anyway. If you don't know, this is the actual bolt that connects the Selespeed actuator engagement piston to the gear selection lever shaft in the gearbox.

Baz

Patty - 2004 Alfa 156 2.0JTS Sportwagon

Ruby - 2000 Alfa 156 2.0 TS Selespeed with Sports Pack
(Eibach 2.5 Lowering Springs)
(Bilstein Sports Dampers )
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(Post Link) post #8 of 11 Old 13-09-16 Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by bazzbazz View Post
When you say it "skips" 3rd gear, do you mean it drops to neutral or it hunts around for 3rd, can't seem to find it and skips the gear and selects 4th or 5th?
Baz
it cant find 3rd and skips to gear 4 after short delay.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bazzbazz View Post
If it's the former check how long the Accumulator holds pressure for, if its the latter try retightening the "pinch bolt" to the correct torque. If it loosens the slightest it will cause it to have trouble getting past 3rd.
Baz
i need to check how much time the Accumulator holds the pressure.

for the "pinch bolt" , ill be glad if you guide me how to do it, with picture or anything. is there any guide for that?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bazzbazz View Post
You can do an "Engagement lever pin test" which is another name for the "Pinch Bolt". If it fails, it's definitely loose, if it passes it could still be loose so check it anyway. If you don't know, this is the actual bolt that connects the Selespeed actuator engagement piston to the gear selection lever shaft in the gearbox.
Baz
"Engagement lever pin test" if i remember right.. was done and successed

thanks all for helping me
you are great!

Last edited by el@d147; 13-09-16 at 07:58.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by el@d147 View Post
it cant find 3rd and skips to gear 4 after short delay.
I could be wrong, but does sound exactly like a Pinch Bolt Starting to come loose.

Just Google or search on here "Selespeed Pinch Bolt", there are heaps of guides and descriptions.

Baz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bazzbazz View Post
Yes you DO have to have your foot on the brake pedal, because what people don't realise is that the first thing an EOL does is ANOTHER Clutch Drain Sequence at the start of the Calibration! It used to frustrate the crap out of me when I first started working on Alfas & Selespeeds as the EOL would pass/fail randomly, till I realised when it passed it was because it just so happened at the time I had my foot resting on the brake.
I know you've work on quite a number of them. But for me it was not required. Let me share my experience.

I've had a worn pump in the past and changing to a reconditioned one it works fine, the pressure is good since the accumulator is new. But calibration only works intermittently as you said. One day the pump only comes on intermittently. Thinking the pump must be bad I bought a brand new one and put it in. After that calibration works every single time. And I follows the instructions so brake pedal was never depressed.

The points I found very interesting were:
1. With the reconditioned pump the clutch drain procedure completes every single time. No fault.
2. With the calibration though, the pump will stop after a while as you know the calibration makes intensive use of the pump. If the pump is not able to keep up it will stop and throw a fault.
3. I opened up the reconditioned pump thinking I got conned. But there is plenty of carbon brush left and the commutator is in good condition.
I've not been able to explain why the reconditioned pump does not work well for the calibration.

Quote:
it cant find 3rd and skips to gear 4 after short delay.
I've had this too. It was down to the big Selespeed harness connector near the battery. Cleaning the connector helps but in my case, actually some of the pin receptacles are not tight enough. The contact is still there but vibration might cause it to loosen a bit and throw an error from time to time. I bent the receptacles so that it 'bites' on the pin better. Never have any problem since.

Do check the pinch bolt too as suggested by Baz. Sometimes several kind of problems can give the same symptom so you'll need to check them one by one.
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Have a read of this and see if it sounds familiar.

ausalfa.com ? View topic - 156 sele upshift problems......fixed

Baz
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