JTS and TS - Alfa Romeo Forum
You are currently unregistered, register for more features.    
 1Likes
  • 1 Post By joeymannero
 
Thread Tools
(Post Link) post #1 of 11 Old 27-08-16 Thread Starter
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Leicester
County: -Leicestershire
Posts: 251
JTS and TS

Are the two engines basically the same? Long time since i ran my 156 ts sw but with the engine covers removed my daughters jts engine looks pretty similar to my old ts motor. Nothing riding on it, I'm just curious.
alfski is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Status: Dreaming
AO Silver Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Orpington, Kent
Posts: 1,023
Yes, the 2.0 JTS was the same engine as the TS but with single plugs and it was also, I was told, designed to run hotter for greater fuel efficiency. I admit I don't know how this was achieved, but I do know (to my substantial cost) that it made the engine more prone to overheating. Number 3 coil and plug were beside the hottest part of the engine and tended to suffer, but mine blew its head gasket for good measure.

The 159's 2.2 petrol engine was no relation at all, being GM rather than Fiat based, and they only called it a JTS to confuse us all.
Sterzo is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
philm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: I would rather not say
County: -
Posts: 114

Member car:

Alfa Romeo

The JTS has direct injection which contributes to the excellent fuel economy. I thought the twin spark was indirect? so I would expect the heads to be different around the intake port along with different ancilliaries. I had a 2.0JTS Sportwagon and thought it fantastic.
philm is offline  
 
(Post Link) post #4 of 11 Old 27-08-16 Thread Starter
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Leicester
County: -Leicestershire
Posts: 251
we had a 1.6 156 ts sw and it was great. went well enough,lugged three kids and two labradors around and did good mpg. we ran it for three years before scrapping it when it needed variator and some other stuff doing. We only paid 500 quid for it and spent little else on it. Was my second Alfa.
alfski is offline  
Status: Howling around Leicestershire
AO Silver Member
 
ferret-ears's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: United Kingdom
County: Leicestershire
Posts: 1,158
Images: 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by alfski View Post
Are the two engines basically the same? Long time since i ran my 156 ts sw but with the engine covers removed my daughters jts engine looks pretty similar to my old ts motor. Nothing riding on it, I'm just curious.
I used to have a 2.0TS 156 from new, which I ran for 6 years and 50,000 miles, it never missed a beat and sounded amazing (but only when it was approaching 7,000RPM!) Since then I've owned a 2.2 JTS 159 the (GM JTS) and it sounds dull. Never tried an Alfa JTS though.
ferret-ears is offline  
(Post Link) post #6 of 11 Old 27-08-16 Thread Starter
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Leicester
County: -Leicestershire
Posts: 251
Daughters 2.0 jts GT sounds fabulous but it is fitted with an aftermarket less restrictive exhaust. Does reasonable mpg and goes well. Not light speed acceleration but brisk. I like it so much i want one for myself.....
alfski is offline  
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
County: -
Posts: 106

Member car:

156

JTS block is almost the same like TS block since it is an evolution of the TS engine.
The main difference is in the cylinder head. The JTS has direct injection and reverted to single spark plug. You can see that the injector location is very different. I will say that the engine sounds a bit different from the TS too due to the different cylinder head design. The JTS makes a bit more torque (~15%) too and that is at lower RPM so it is actually quite powerful.

The JTS in 159 are based on GM units so the blocks are totally different. However, they too are using direct injection hence the name JTS.
gwinter is offline  
(Post Link) post #8 of 11 Old 28-08-16 Thread Starter
Status: -
AO Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Leicester
County: -Leicestershire
Posts: 251
That's pretty interesting. Who made the blocks in the Gt JTS circa 2004? The extra torque from my old 156 to engine is noticeable on my daughters car. Feels stronger. Is the JTS at all tuneable from the Ecu ?
alfski is offline  
Status: Planning summer upgrades
AO Member
 
AussieAlex's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Aussie in Sweden
County: Stockholm
Posts: 779
Images: 12
Garage
Quote:
Originally Posted by alfski View Post
That's pretty interesting. Who made the blocks in the Gt JTS circa 2004? The extra torque from my old 156 to engine is noticeable on my daughters car. Feels stronger. Is the JTS at all tuneable from the Ecu ?
Like the TS before it, there is almost no point in remapping the JTS. You might be lucky to pick up 10 bhp (peak) and maybe 10-15nM. So you will get very marginal gains for the cost.
AussieAlex is offline  
Status: On Alfa number 15
AO Platinum Member
 
symon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: United Kingdom
County: Oxfordshire
Posts: 34,175
Images: 13
Early versions of the 2.0 were plagued with running and reliability issues.

Flat spots, carbon build up in the inlet, and low power outputs. 130bhp was normally the output they gave.

The carbon in the inlet and on the inlet vales is common to many direct injection engines and is caused by the crankcase ventilation dumping oil fumes into the inlet so that they can be burned. But with no fuel being sprayed on the back of the inlet valves it builds up and carbonises rather than being washed into the cylinder by the fuel.

Later versions were better and had more low end torque then the TS, but they lost much of the zingyness which made the TS more than just an engine.

I have a couple of work collegues, both of which have JTS 156's

One is a pre-facelift and he reckons it is both slow and not very economical (about 25mpg average).

The other one is a facelifted car, and he seems to get around 30mpg and his car does go a bit better.

Both have been reliable apart from needing coil packs on a couple of occasions, and both have a thirst for oil.


Personally though I would rather have a TS, especially if a CF2 variant was an option.

You will never be cool driving a Vauxhall, especially if it catches fire.
symon is offline  
Status: now a diesel head..
AO Silver Member
 
joeymannero's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: United Kingdom
County: Surrey
Posts: 1,828
having owned both, a JTS in a GT and currently a TS 2.0 in a GTV they are chalk and cheese, the TS is revvy ,sonourous ,reliable and just has a wonderful character that make for a real drivers engine, my other car is a 230 BHP hybrid turbo GT and honestly the TS in the GTV is as much fun , absolutely no question! and If I am honest with the windows down and a B road to play on even more so than the derv..

The JTS which i had was 05 plate so later , however the sound as ''meh'' so so, in fact the M44 in my previous 3 series sounded better, and the the TS is markedly nicer sounding than both...in fact I think its one of the nicest sounding 4 pots currently available to buy on the used market, end of.

the jts suffered from oil starvation issues to the top end resulting in premature camshaft wear ( mine needed anew exhaust camshft at 38k) this was due to the petrol contaminating the oil and thinning it...and a hardening issue with the shafts from the factory.

as the last real ''alfa engine'' before the GM JTS the JTS is a real disappointment being both underpowered and most of the time nowhere near the 165 ponies claimed by Alfa, and unreliable and uninspiring when compared to its predecessor the fantastic TS.

so are they basically the same..? hell no! one will be viewed with respect and affection for years to come and one will simply be considered a ''blip'' .

totally agree with Symon above, i have a phase I GTV so a CF2 155 BHP 2.0 TS and its absolutely fantastic...
symon likes this.

GT blackline,Bilstien B12's and Eibach Anti roll bar kit,Quaife Diff,Autolusso performance pads, de-cat downpipe,hybrid turbo,stage one clutch,autolusso re-map, swirl flap and egr delete, leon cupra front splitter,novitec light covers,simone racing gear knob.
joeymannero is online now  
Reply

Go Back   Alfa Romeo Forum > Supported Alfa Romeo Models > Technical & Vehicle Assistance > Alfa 147, 156 & GT

Tags
jts

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome