My Progress & Timing Question

According to the workshop manual there's actually a special tool that Alfa use to lock the flywheel for removal of that bolt, however I've never actually removed the bottom cover of the bell housing or had to lock the flywheel myself so I'm can't say what the exact setup is or how it bolts on. You would need to take a look yourself...

WorkshopManualRemovingCrankPulleyBolt1.jpg

There is also an alternative way to do it using a different tool that actually bolts to the pulley and then is anchored to another part of the engine block...

WorkshopManualRemovingCrankPulleyBolt2.jpg

As AJ already mentioned, the thread on the bolt is left-handed.

You can't see much with the fly wheel cover off, I can't think where it would lock to, I guess something on the bellhousing? Which is probalby alloy, so go careful or the way your luck is going you'll be looking for a new bellhousing as well! I'd guess it locks on the ring gear and against the casing rather than through the flywheel onto the block.

That counter torque tool looks quite useful if you can construct something that bolts onto the face of the pulley.

Right, thanks guys. I will make something with pins to match the crank pulley, 2 holes for the bolts and 1 large centre hole. will have the bracket bolt on to the block somewhere (maybe use the 2 holes used for the tensioner plate). Will then do what AJ suggested with putting it in gear and firly applying brakes then use a large 3/4 inch breaker bar for the bolt.

That should get it, living on a farm has it's uses so i can get a large torque wrench for tightening.

Originally Posted by ajcarter

the way your luck is going you'll be looking for a new bellhousing as well!

or a new car.

My wife is fuming, was supossed to be taking her to inverness. She mocking my alfa...saying it's glued together

will need to glue her mouth

I finally removed the crank pulley. The brakes were not holding with the strength required. So i used my variator tool to hold the crank, got the wife to hold the brake and off it came not a problem here is pics

Have sent Ned at autolusso the pics and they are going to replace the parts for me.

There is light at the end of the tunnel now, hopefully nothing else was bodged up.

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This is the variator tool that fits perfect on the crank pulley

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Back again with a quick question, as i am aware the white marks on the new belt line up with the notch on the ex cam sprocket and the notch on the crank pulley. When i line up the mark on the exhaust pulley the other white mark sits half way between the idler pulley and the crank. Does this indicate that i may have the wrong belt.

The white marks don't nessesarily mean you have the wrong belt, as some belts don't even have white marks.

Have you got the old belt? As the easiest way to check would be to lay them side to side and see if they are the same length. They should have the same number of teeth as well.

On the timing belt changes I have done I have ignored the marks on the belts, and just relied on the cam locks, and the white mark on the auxillary belt pulley to eset no1 piston to TDC.

Once the engine has been turned over the marks on the belt will no longer line up anyway, but the lower pulley mark should always line up with the cam locks fitted.

The problem i am having is that when the crank is at TDC, I run the belt from the crank to the ex sprocket and it will not fit the teeth of the sprocket. The belt will only succesfully fit the teeth when the crank is either left or right of the tdc mark. It appears the exhaust sprocket is out half a tooth....but i have not adjusted it.

Originally Posted by andylossie

The problem i am having is that when the crank is at TDC, I run the belt from the crank to the ex sprocket and it will not fit the teeth of the sprocket. The belt will only succesfully fit the teeth when the crank is either left or right of the tdc mark. It appears the exhaust sprocket is out half a tooth....but i have not adjusted it.

You will need to slacken the exhaust pulley to allow the marks to line up. Even if you havent edjusted it there is a good chance that it will be out in relation to the lower pulley. I am not totally sure why this happens, but it may be due to it not being set correctly before you started, or due to a slight amount of stretch in the old belt.

Thanks simon... wow this cars turning out to be a pain. got everything timed and tensioned, i used the tensioning tool and the pin sits way past the pin, but i presume after a few revolutions the tension will get redone. But there seems to be alot of resistance when i started turning the crank as 1 is starting its exhaust stroke is this normal, i just left it for now untill i can get some verification about the resistance.

Thanks for all the help

There will be a lot of resistance when turning the crank with the spark plugs in, as when cylinder one is on its exhaust stroke, number 4 will be on its compression stroke. If you have the timing wrong and the pistons are touching the valves it will come to a dead stop..

I am not sure about the tensioner though, the way I have checked mine is after turning the engine by hand, is to replace the cam cover and start the engine.
Make sure you keep fingers away, if you look at the pointer on the tensioner it should hover over the hole.

You won't have the other belts on at this time, so the charging warning lamp will be on.

Originally Posted by andylossie

But there seems to be alot of resistance when i started turning the crank as 1 is starting its exhaust stroke is this normal, i just left it for now untill i can get some verification about the resistance.

There WILL be a lot of resistance as the cams are pressing on the valve springs because they are very strong (double springs are used). The best way to turn the engine over by hand if you're not already doing it this way is to put the car into 5th gear, put the drivers side wheel back on loosely with a couple of bolts and turn the engine over by rotating the wheel (make sure the passenger side wheel is on the floor). It's much easier doing it this way although you will still feel some 'notchiness' as you turn the wheel as each set of valves are pressed open in turn. Obviously make sure the spark plugs are out while doing this as then you aren't fighting against and compression.

All plugs have been out from the start, is it ok for the tensioner pointer to be sitting higer for now (Before the 2 Revolutions) does the pointer start pointing to the pin once this is done.....i dont want to put toomuch strain on the belt.

Here is the pics of the tensioner, the pin seems to be sitting high and after a number of revolutions still sits high. Is this too tight for the belt as i have seen that it should sit at the pin. If i slacken any more the run between the cams seem to slacken too much. Should i stop fussing and put it back together before i find more problems .

Originally Posted by andylossie

Here is the pics of the tensioner, the pin seems to be sitting high and after a number of revolutions still sits high. Is this too tight for the belt as i have seen that it should sit at the pin. If i slacken any more the run between the cams seem to slacken too much. Should i stop fussing and put it back together before i find more problems .

That's too tight. After everything settles following a few revolutions of the engine, while the engine is turning the pointer should hover around the hole in the bracket. Are you turning the engine over by hand or on the starter motor? Doing so on the starter motor gives you a more realistic view of what is going on when the engine turns at speed. Get your wife to hold the key at the starter motor position while you see what's going on with the rotating belts and tensioners.

Was turning with starter....and its way too tight and that was me using an idiot proof tensioning tool. I think because i had to loosen the exhaust cam pulley and with the adjustment in the inlet cam i have pulled the belts too tight along the cams and in turn has put more tension on the tensioner....I think

I wish i had not started this, but truth of the matter i dont think there is any garage local that specialise in alfas, its just been one problem after another....i have the box of matches waiting .

I really appreciate the help you guys have given.

One thing i have noticed is that the inlet lobe that sits in the block has too much play for my liking the inlet cam will not settle in the middle of the cam block, although it does fit in the lobe it is resting on the edge . I dont think there will be a problem with this as the lobe is still inside the block. The exhaust lobe sits perfectly central to the block.

Originally Posted by andylossie

Was turning with starter....and its way too tight and that was me using an idiot proof tensioning tool. I think because i had to loosen the exhaust cam pulley and with the adjustment in the inlet cam i have pulled the belts too tight along the cams and in turn has put more tension on the tensioner....I think

Not sure how you've done the loosening and tightening of the cam pulleys but they way it should be done is that you loosen both pulleys then fit and fully tension the cam belt. Only then do you tighten the bolts in the two cam pulleys (4 bolts on the inlet one first then the single bolt on the exhaust one next). If you do it this way you shouldn't be able to get it wrong.

Originally Posted by andylossie

One thing i have noticed is that the inlet lobe that sits in the block has too much play for my liking the inlet cam will not settle in the middle of the cam block, although it does fit in the lobe it is resting on the edge . I dont think there will be a problem with this as the lobe is still inside the block. The exhaust lobe sits perfectly central to the block.

It's been a while since I last used the cam locking blocks on my engine but I'm sure the inlet cam is sprung from the force on two of the lobes by their respective valve springs. This means that as long as the lobe cut-out in the locking blocks has been machined correctly then you won't have an issue as the lobe will be sprung against one side of the cut-out so the inlet cam will be held in the correct position.

Out of interest, where did you get your cam locking blocks from (i.e. were they from a specialist / dealer)?

I got a loan of the blocks from the place i got the car (GTA Car sales) got the tensioning tools.

Maybe i should ask who the previous owner is so i can give him a good head bashing for making my first alfa belt change so fecking long and costly.

Never mind nearly done, at least its not been bodged together this time.

Originally Posted by andylossie

Maybe i should ask who the previous owner is so i can give him a good head bashing for making my first alfa belt change so fecking long and costly.

Package up all the broken parts and send them to him in the post...after gluing them back together with pritt stick first

Originally Posted by GialloEvo94

Package up all the broken parts and send them to him in the post...after gluing them back together with pritt stick first

it's an easy belt change when things go right.

That was an interesting read!

How long did it take you to get everyting sorted and out of interest, how long do you think it should take to change all the parts under the normal course of events?