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A 156 buyer's puzzlement

4K views 60 replies 17 participants last post by  AutobotVanguard 
#1 ·
Hello Alfistas,

As the weeks and months pass my Alfa 156 budget is rising, my drinking buddies wonder if I'm still alive and my girlfriend wonders why I'm suddenly keen on going for walks rather than going anywhere else.

My my budget will be around £5000 for which I'd like to buy an Alfa red/silver 1.9 JTD 150 facelift with 17" wheels, leather interior and under 60k on the clock. In reality, finding such an example is proving to be hard work (there's always one thing wrong) and I'm thinking that I might have to slip 20k on mileage. I'm in no hurry to buy and have no intention of giving up on getting the car I want so I'm thinking outside the box a little here perhaps, but could I purchase a full leather interior and have it retrofitted to the car? Has anyone tried this? Would this affect insurance since its original kit?

Secondly, why do I keep seeing 140bhp lumps when most figures quote 115 or 150?

Thirdly, are facelift 1 or pre-facelift models much different on mechanicals or was it mainly a nosejob?

Any help would be greatly appreciated,

Regards,

Nick
 
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#4 ·
Badger, it's my first car. Only because I have a few years driving experience on my parents policies is my projected premium anything less than terrifying.



Because 140 is the correct figure...!
Only the last facelift runout "Sport" 156 had the 150hp engine.

...and with low miles they are chicken teeth! The sport also has the suspension pack which was only an option on the Veloce I think. Both the ones I was eyeing have sold now :( Thanks for the info, I'm off for a sulk for a while now...
 
#3 ·
Secondly, why do I keep seeing 140bhp lumps when most figures quote 115 or 150?
Because 140 is the correct figure...!
Only the last facelift runout "Sport" 156 had the 150hp engine.


Thirdly, are facelift 1 or pre-facelift models much different on mechanicals or was it mainly a nosejob?
Mainly cosmetic.
 
#10 ·
No £5000 is spent on her, £1100 is what Admiral want to insure a 140/150 JTD with my dad as a named driver. This works out cheaper than insuring a 147 with the same engine for some peculiar reason and since I plan to keep the car until someone makes something prettier, I can watch the premium drop to circa £600 within 3 years of protected no claims.
 
#6 ·
My 156 is my first car and it took me three months to find what I wanted. Cost me way over book value too (£5k for a 2005 JTS) but at the time, a year ago, it was so obviously difficult to find the right one that it was a seller's market. Not so true now I think, but I'm not buying. Oh and I wanted red but settled on Moon Blue and I'm really glad I did.

Yes, you can transplant an interior for a few hundred quid - Autolusso may have one. You need to make sure it has airbags in it, and you probably want to do the door cards too. You're probably meant to tell the insurer, and it may have no effect, but I can't see that anyone would ever pick it up.

I looked at GTA insurance premiums and they were only marginally higher (£1700 vs £1500), maybe because the insurers treat it as a normal 156. I didn't even think of getting one though because I don't think it'd be a sensible car for someone with very limited experience.
 
#11 ·
I'm all about tlc :)

My 156 is my first car and it took me three months to find what I wanted. Cost me way over book value too (£5k for a 2005 JTS) but at the time, a year ago, it was so obviously difficult to find the right one that it was a seller's market. Not so true now I think, but I'm not buying. Oh and I wanted red but settled on Moon Blue and I'm really glad I did.
There were two loaded [140] Lusso's down south with 50k behind them for 5k recently but they are gone now. It's just difficult seeing a minter go off the radar when you're still saving, but better to watch the market in case anything goes back on sale too quick than to save myself from a few minor disappointments.

dont be put off by the mileage! I got my 55 plate sport with 91k miles on it for £3800, pristine condition inside and out, i have now done £25k miles this year in it and apart from 2 services (thanks Mototech), second hand heater fan and disks and pads all round its been a dream, feels just as tight to drive as my last 3.2 V6 Spider that only had 55k miles on it when i sold her...........
I suppose you're right. 80k isn't quite Pluto and back on a diesel. My dad has 52k on his Fiesta and that has a gearshift like a clowns pocket though (he slows down with his gears because the brakes are um... rusty). Turns out the engine revs to 7000 though... so that would appear to be fine... My main concern is general wear and tear on the mechanicals because clutches aren't generally cheap and 70k implies one might be due. I'll be working part time next year while I complete my degree (I'm 26), so components going pop is the last thing I need. That said, student bus tickets are cheap and there's always my Xmas list...

Thanks for your advice so far chaps, I might stretch to 80k and have leather fitted later. How can you tell if a Veloce has sports suspension? Obviously they are standard on the sport model, but were they optional or standard on the Lusso? Is Veloce the sportier standard options and Lusso the luxury options basically?

Nick
 
#9 ·
dont be put off by the mileage! I got my 55 plate sport with 91k miles on it for £3800, pristine condition inside and out, i have now done £25k miles this year in it and apart from 2 services (thanks Mototech), second hand heater fan and disks and pads all round its been a dream, feels just as tight to drive as my last 3.2 V6 Spider that only had 55k miles on it when i sold her...........
 
#13 ·
And in the news this week:

Both Stromboli Grey 156 1.9jtd facelift Sports on Autotrader have sold which makes me quite sad, especially since I was one paycheck away from buying one of them and getting it on the road. There is a 156 Sport-Cloverleaf in black which has appeared since. Is this a genuine 'Sport' or was the cloverleaf pack even available on the facelift model? It has what appears to be TI interior too. I might snap this one up next time I'm paid (I got paid last night), or...

I get a quiver down my spine every time I'm passed by an Alfa GT on the open roads and in 2 months I could afford a JTD with leathers... The cons are the lower fuel consumption and pricier parts compared to a 156. I'm still a student on part time wages afterall... but I do have a student loan... and I can't think of any better use for my £1500 (mature) student loan installment than topping up my car budget :)

What do you chaps think?

Nick
 
#15 ·
And in the news this week:

Both Stromboli Grey 156 1.9jtd facelift Sports on Autotrader have sold which makes me quite sad, especially since I was one paycheck away from buying one of them and getting it on the road. There is a 156 Sport-Cloverleaf in black which has appeared since. Is this a genuine 'Sport' or was the cloverleaf pack even available on the facelift model? It has what appears to be TI interior too. I might snap this one up next time I'm paid (I got paid last night), or...
Nick
Is this the one with the plate ending VXL? I think Cloverleaf was a UK dealer label, maybe Mangoletsi's - not an official spec, not that it makes much difference. Things that concern me a little about that ad: no interior pics, the reg shows as 140bhp and also not Sport on a checker (may well be wrong) and I didn't think the official Sport pack came out until the runout models in 2005. In the end none of that makes much practical difference, just be aware.
 
#14 ·
trust. wait u you will be rewarded... i waited a yr before my car fell in my lap - in my time 3 slipped thru my fingers including a real cheap black facelift jts...

but in the end ended up with a real nice ultra rare v6 6sp.... well worth it.... it may not be for u based on fuel and insurance, but point being, be patient. it will happen...

and the less finance on a car the better. esp an alfa.
 
#17 ·
Well I'm in negotiations over a pretty nice sounding 156, but it's as near as makes no difference in Italy (130 miles), I'm close to tears over a mint Sport in Dudley which has 2 viewing booked since it went up this morning and will be gone by the time I can get there and I'm viewing a GT jtd which is 'cheap for a quick sale' (£4250) on Friday evening (Suspicious any?). However it's in 'dubious gold' metallic (official colour name?) with black leather which makes it look a bit like Lilly Savage on her way to the bingo. I only considered a GT in the first instance because there were no decent Sports left on Autotrader.

Now if I could only find my black airfix paint, I could put leopard prints on it...

I really like black with red leather, red or Gabbiano blue with tan leathers on Alfas. What is the chances of one of those being sold near to me which hasn't been to Pluto and back. Yet again my impatience has gotten the better of me as I rush to secure some Italian metal largely because the last one I wanted sold. Do I spend £3000 on a 156 or £4000-5000 on a GT? Life is so full of difficult questions...

Well I'm off to mourn the passing of another Stromboli beauty , there will be another star twinkling in the sky tonight :'(
 
#18 ·
don't rush... u guys have plenty of alfas to go round.... decide if u want a gt or 156, which is only slightly more practical... then pull the trigger on a mint one.... paying a bit extra is fine, as if u pay 3k now on a marginal call u will regret it and still always want the one u were after... just sayin'
 
#22 ·
Alfisti,

I went to see the 'Dubious Ivory' JTD GT this morning but I think I'm walking away from this one. I smiled when we turned into the road and saw the Alfa shining away there, in sunlight muted through the clouds. However the scene greyed when I cast my eyes across the sellers house which was up for sale with the 'prop' mossy VW Caravelle, apparently from a 'Day of the Triffids' budget UK sequel parked on the double driveway. The chap was smiley and friendly enough and hand shakey and all that good stuff. The Triffid-mobile, it turned out is his elderly neighbours affirmation that that the only thing that she is more incredulous towards than gardening or new cars, is new neighbours. I wish our seller luck with the house sale.

Anyhow, we're here to discuss cars and I digress again... The car was nice outside, I couldn't drive it because I don't currently have an insurance policy of my own. My dad... well he drives a petrol Fiesta and Corsa and so was there mainly for observation and advice. The chap took us for a drive including a fast stretch to '70Mph Constable' ;) where the engine sounded solid and pulled well, interior was a bit shabby but this was expected on 86,000 miles of car. Of minor concern was the 'Water in oil filter' warning on ignition. The main problem was the 10mm light bubbling around a 3mm rust spot in the middle of the roof above the centre of the front screen. The paint was mildly faded elsewhere which suggests that any paint match job would be difficult, not that I was ever majorly keen on the colour, also all the Alfa Badges had faded which maybe suggests prolonged sunlight exposure? Or cheap car wash detergent? Anyway, I hear that good resprays are £1000+ which I could as well put toward a £5,250 spotless example in red or blue next time I'm paid or a 156 with a Q2 ;)



Yep, I think you're right. Though it's not discussed, everyone is left a bit disappointed when you blow your proverbial load too soon and nobody more so than I would be if I let impulse get the better of me. I might not get another one that cheap (do I want one suspiciously reduced to clear anyway?), but in 2 months I can afford the next GT price hike and buy a better and newer car in my preferred colours. So basically you're saying... 'go slow when buying, go fast when bought'. :)

Arguably the GT is more practical than the 156, since it's actually a hatch and has folding rear seats ... depends whether you'd find the cargo space or the rear doors more useful.
Practicality concerns are a non-entity since it will mostly transport 1-2 persons anyway. So for the record asking '156 or GT?' = a brunette vs. blonde debate. Quite simply, I like both therefore secondary considerations such as bodywork condition and what they have under their bonnet are of greater concern to me :)

Anyway, possible 156 viewing in a couple of weeks so I'll keep you all posted... :)
 
#23 ·
So a few more weeks have passed and I'm still without a car. I have been keeping a low profile because I was arranging a viewing on a forum members car but it turned out not to be what I was looking for (completely gutted) so I'm back looking. I have seen a couple of 156's in the metal now and I know that I definitely want a facelift Veloce, Sport or TI. I am also growing partial to TI and GTA leathers so its lucky that my funds have reached just over £4.5k now. I'm happy to settle for a 140bhp though because there are just too few Sports and TIs about to make them a realistic aspiration :( Of course I'm still keen on GTs if I can find a good one for less that 5k.
 
#27 ·
This is precisely what I have in mind, plus an Eibach ARB kit and 10mm spacers all round. Sports car looks for lemonade money... or something to that effect.

Would you consider a petrol model? I know where there's a nice one for sale. ;)
Haha, are you still trying to sell me that thing? :p

If petrol was cheap and petrol Alfas were either economical or reliable... in a second. Since I'm not moving to America and my mechanical know-how extends to Mechano sets and bicycle puncture repair kits, probably not any time soon. Its diesel power for me all the way because until I finish this degree my earning power is nearly nil.

Thanks anyway Roswell.
 
#28 · (Edited)
There is some maths to be done there - on the one hand, ~£2k less buys you a lot of petrol, which is cheaper anyway; and on the other, the resale will be lower, its end-of-life mileage is probably lower, it returns about 30mpg and the JTS may be more fragile.

I haven't seen any evidence to suggest that a diesel is more reliable than say a twinny though - this era of diesels were arguably better than the current ones though, no DPFs for starters.
 
#42 ·
The diesel will return another 20 mpg and more plus torque with a remap. I thought the diesels were generally considered to be the least flakey of the Alfa engines alongside the V6s. Is the TS more solid than the JTS?

If Roswell puts a 1.9 tractor engine in his TI then I'll buy it now :) 89k on the clock scares me because I don't know what that means in terms of upcoming bills and engine lifespan. If he can convince me that the engine will last at least 40,000 miles before it needs a rebuild (whatever that means or costs??) then I might buy it anyway. I'm a student though so I'm not sure that a 30mpg option is a wise one. That said, I have budgeted 4.5k for a car and he's asking much less... and that TI leather...

I want a JTD TI now :'(
 
#38 ·
All I wanted was a humble Sport, I didn't even ask for a TI... and alfacool has got one and is rubbing my face in it with pictures of it's epic prettiness and now I hope a bit that he has a non car related accident so it goes up for sale... Ahem... :p
 
#43 · (Edited)
My JTS (70k) has been fine for the year I've owned it, but is a little bit broken now, and I'm quickly learning about what could go wrong - rather than what actually has, which is still unknown. The TS is pretty solid and any failings like cam belts and oil usage carry over to the JTS. The JTS then adds potential headaches with a few oft-reported issues: injectors, cam lobe wear, at least an extra lambda, some issues with the wiring loom, and carbon buildup in the early ones. You would have to be very unlucky to experience all of this, obviously!

I imagine a well maintained one will make far in excess of 130k no problem, and I'm sure Ros' is exactly that, but you will have to ask to see what he's gone through in the last few years.

Edit: 8/63 JTSes on Autotrader have 100k+, and that's without looking at GTVs and GTs. Not worth anything when they get there mind!
 
#45 ·
I just bought a spotless 156 Sport with 40k on it so It's ok. I'm not sure I could be happier, though don't tell my girlfriend that :p I knew it was good when Classic FM came on the radio as I started it up. She has clearly been loved very much by her previous boyfriend.

Now I'm a completed alfisti too with an Alfa to prove it. Thank you to you all for your support and advice. Pictures up as soon as she is valeted :D
 
#51 · (Edited)
If the bushes are the a/r bar droplinks, then relatively simple to fix, but the old ones can be a pain to get off in one piece ... so a hacksaw or angle grinder comes in handy!

If the upper wishbones, then relatively simple to fix .. two new upper arms plus a new droplinks as you have to take these off to do the uppers!

If it's the lower arms, then more expensive and harder.

If it's the a/r bar bushes, then very expensive .... the dealer will squirm at the thought of paying for that!
 
#54 ·
The knocking has been sorted, it was the front left suspension linkage. Whatever was done sorted the issue but now my brakes on that wheel are rubbing. Mostly its an intermittent friction squeak but on occasion when accelerating I get a minor snag of brakes. I'm going to run it like this for another week because I don't fancy driving another 3 hour journey to the dealer, though they have agreed to sort any problems without quibbles thus far. What might be causing this and should I take it super easy for a while? Otherwise I'm over the moon. She is gorgeous and plenty rapid!
 
#52 ·
What is the difference between mine (a Veloce) and the Sport?

Not sure about only the sport having the 150 as mine shows as a 150 on the documentation and when I quote the reg to insurance companys!
 
#53 ·
The Sport was a run off (2005) edition Veloce in Stromboli Grey with black leather Interior and different 17in alloys. David C. (seems to know his stuff backwards and inside out) confirmed that it was only the Sport with the 150 engine and 140 for the rest on page 1 of this chat. My Sport has the 'JTD M-Jet 16v' engine (as per my V5C) which was also used in the GT. If yours is a late Veloce then I suppose it's possible, but more likely the insurance database is incorrect. For instance, a quote with Aviva listed my registration online as a JTD (115) 8v. Admirals records appear to be pretty accurate in my experience. Check your plate on there and see whether you have been paying group 14 costs for a group 13 car. The difference at the wheels is 9.1 rather than 9.6 seconds to 62 as per Autotraders 'estimation' system. It's not a competition anyway... we can both make Mk4 Golf drivers squirm like we're going to steal and ruin their girlfriends when we pull up next to them at the traffic lights, haha :p
 
#57 ·
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