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Swirl flaps How To and MAF clean How To anywhere? 159 1.9

66K views 418 replies 23 participants last post by  driver33p4 
#1 ·
Still working to solve problem and working through the list of jobs that should solve my 1.9Ti which is barely drivable at the moment.

I'm looking for a guide or how to on checking and replacing the swirl valves. I have the black plastic type of inlet manifold and I'm not sure where the swirl valves are. Underneath is all I have read but I'm still struggling to see them. Any pictures or a guide most appreciated.

Also a guide or how to on cleaning the MAF so I can rule that problem out also. I want to do a thorough clean, so if they is a better way than just using carb cleaner spray please help.

Last job will be a DPF clean or drill out. Will do my homework more on this when its last thing to do. Gona do all the sensors first. Already done EGR few weeks ago, but gona check it again. How do I know or how do I check if I have any component that's faulty even after cleaning were the only option is a new part (this question in relation to the normal parts, MAF, EGR, MAP, BOOST SENSOR etc)? Will a diagnostic show these normally as iv had one done and no fault of error codes showing.
 
#399 ·
I have used search but I do not eventually find it.
Let me ask the question here.
Has anyone who care his swirl flaps also succeeded to strip swirl flaps motor off ( As attached ) ???...
As soon as it switched off ECU shows up with P2014 failure code
As I learned from mapper it is impossible to map ECU this way. Or the mapper is not good.
Should I use any resistor similar to EGR device simulation ???...
Please let me know solution if any...
 

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#401 ·
I have used search but I do not eventually find it.

Let me ask the question here.

Has anyone who care his swirl flaps also succeeded to strip swirl flaps motor off ( As attached ) ???...

As soon as it switched off ECU shows up with P2014 failure code

As I learned from mapper it is impossible to map ECU this way. Or the mapper is not good.

Should I use any resistor similar to EGR device simulation ???...

Please let me know solution if any...


Did your car go into limp mode when that code came up?
 
#400 ·
It would be good to lose that piece of junk, but I have no idea whether or how it is possible. From looking inside I don't think a single resistance value would work. From memory there is what looked like a potentiometer in the actuator, so probably a variable resistance tells the ECU how open the flaps are. If you take off the black plastic cover under the clips you may get a better idea. I don't even know if it's a dumb device or CAN node.
 
#403 ·
2 could be power to the motor, plus 2 to read potentiometer resistance as feedback of the flap position. That's what I'd expect if the actuator is dumb. ECU would just supply motor v until a required r is achieved. If it's that simple I think it should be possible to map out. Worth asking a specialist Alfa mapping expert anyway.

But if it's Can, God knows...
 
#405 ·
Cheers :) Mine is still absolutely fine, I've needed to do nothing to it since**. Hasn't even needed oil or coolant top up. There is life after swirl flap failure.

** Not entirely true. I have a couple of noisy injectors. #3 was the worst, perhaps not uncoincidentally the cylinder that ate a swirl flap and bent its valves. I replaced that with a reconditioned injector a couple of weeks ago, which restored sanity to the correction values but #4 is noisy when cold at low revs. I'm probably going to get that reconditioned next.
 
#406 ·
Glad to hear that all ended so well for you. It's a mammoth task for a diy'er working outside.

I was relieved to find that all 4 of my flaps were still in place but noticed that one of the flaps was only held by one spot weld.

A bullet dodged!

Just finished cleaning out the inlet manifold and all being well, I start putting it all back together tomorrow :)

Cheers,

Roy.
 
#407 · (Edited)
Gosh, I wish that happened more often. You were one pinhead weld away from disaster.

Three reassembly tips:
  • put the metal part of the manifold in place then insert the studs before adding the plastic part. Much easier and no fouling
  • don't do what I did and mix up the (pale gray) EGR valve plug with the (orangey-brown) swirl flap motor plug! Unfortunately the plug/socket design allows it. Doing so meant I had to take the HP fuel pump and manifold off again to sort that out. I still have my bootmarks on my arse.
  • when replacing the oil separator unit on the back of the head I really struggled with the position and lack of visibility. Only 1 of 3 bolt positions can be seen without mirrors and Capuchin fingers. It suddenly became a doddle when I hit on taping each mounting bolt into a long socket with electrical tape (just enough to hold it in the socket as a 'handle' for the bolt, but pull free once the bolt had started in the thread).
 
#408 ·
Hmm.. I didn't have much of a problem getting the entire manifold off the studs. Just put it back on no problem either. I must be lucky!

I was about to make the same plug mistake as you did... one reason I'm sat on the computer now trying to confirm which it is. Thank you!!

The oil separator unit is a complete arse. Already resigned myself to suffering and bleeding to get it back on - but I will!

Right, a quick brew and I'm back to it :)
 
#409 ·
I was about to make the same plug mistake as you did... one reason I'm sat on the computer now trying to confirm which it is. Thank you!!
The loom makes it seem obvious that the gray plug is nearer to the swirl valve actuator. Wrong!

Just remember Gray=EGR(ay).

The oil separator unit is a complete arse. Already resigned myself to suffering and bleeding to get it back on - but I will!
I really found it easy once I'd taped a socket onto each bolt. The two (invisible) holes toward the n/s end are open slots, the one at the o/s end is easy to see. I think I put a bolt in there loosely as a pivot, then got the other two in place with my taped-on socket 'handle' and feeling when the frame slots lined up with the little tapped turrets in the head casting. TBH I had more trouble taking it off, as I had no idea how the hell it was attached.
 
#410 ·
The loom makes it seem obvious that the gray plug is nearer to the swirl valve actuator. Wrong!

Just remember Gray=EGR(ay).



I really found it easy once I'd taped a socket onto each bolt. The two (invisible) holes toward the n/s end are open slots, the one at the o/s end is easy to see. I think I put a bolt in there loosely as a pivot, then got the other two in place with my taped-on socket 'handle' and feeling when the frame slots lined up with the little tapped turrets in the head casting. TBH I had more trouble taking it off, as I had no idea how the hell it was attached.
With you there, it's going back together a lot faster than it came apart now that I know what goes where.

The separator was indeed a ***** but once I'd shed some blood and appeased the auto-gods, it finally went on ok.

The fuel pump nut nearest the inlet manifold was a challenge! That took a bit of wriggling with a magnet and a screwdriver before I got it on. I'm sure there must be a trick to this somehow.

Did I read something somewhere about a bolt on the water pump needing silicone to prevent it leaking?

Anyway, dinner eaten and I'm back at it. Throttle body needs tightening next :)
 
#411 · (Edited)
Having driven an intact CF4 manifold and deflapped CF4 manifold back to back (Sunday to Tuesday) there's a definite loss in torque below 2500. It no longer has the fantastic torque peak at 2000 that progresses smoothly to redline.... I don't think the swirl valves are just for idle emissions as some claim but for increasing off boost VE (and hence torque). As such I would like to eventually reinstate them. I believe that the tiny plastic bush needs to be replaced with something more durable, so the spindles need to come apart and new flaps made and re-attached... not straightforward. The other option is to install a CF3 intake.... But for now I am glad that I have peace of mind with regarding dislodged swirl flaps...!
 

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#412 ·
The swirl flaps purpose is to mix (swirl) the exhaust gases let by the EGR with the clean air.

They are going in pair - if you remove the swirl flaps, you have to disable the EGR... + remap.
Then you wont lose any power or torque. Actually you'll gain alot :D
 
#414 ·
Hi Guys,

A couple of weeks ago i took off the inlet manifold with the plan to remove the swirl valves and clean it out, unfortunate i have no clue if they had been removed in the past and was getting a little para with swirl valve horror.

When i finally got the manifold of all swirl valves were MIA, now where could they have gone? did a check
to see if they were stuck somewhere deeper in valve section but could not see any.

All four shafts were still in place, i removed these and used a tap and bolted them off since the manifold was leaking
on the bottom due play on the shafts.
In the end my conclusion was they were allready removed in the past by detaching them from the shafts?
i am pretty sure the manifold had been removed in the past since the hidden bolt on the oil bottle frame
was not in place.

Anyone knows if this was standard practice, so only removing the valves and leaving in the shafts
or could they still hanging around somewhere deeper close to the vlvs? i should have checked deeper
with a boroscope i am now thinking :(

The car is a 1.9JTDM 16v 07 with 200K with the semi plastic manifold.

I have used 2 bolts to lock the fuel pump sprocket not sure what happened but after the job i noticed
some cracks, so had to get a new one.

Yesterday one of the plastic tubes broke off the thermostat house and caused a massive coolant spill :eek:

Ahhh it is nice to own a Alfa :p
930315
 
#415 ·
Did you make the M6 30mm temporary bolts very tight against the support bracket? Finger tight is all that's needed, just to hold the pulley in place so you can withdraw the HP pump and keep the cam belt on. Or bash the end of the pump spindle to drive it out? OTOH the crack doesn't look very new, so could relate to an earlier visit by someone else who deleted the flaps. OTOH#2 ISTR the central nut is only supposed to be lightly torqued. I think 25Nm

I think that at 200,000k all flaps would not have stuck in the inlet tracts, at least one would have been ingested and done damage that you'd know about. What was the condition of the welds on the spindles? If encrusted in carbon, they must have been off for a long time.

I've certainly seen others suggest that removing the flaps and leaving the spindles is a way to delete the flaps without having to block holes. But as you say, it's going to allow filth to leak into the rack-and-pinion in the bottom of the manifold, so a bit of a bodge idea.
 
#416 ·
Many Thanks for your reply, the spindels where covered in a nice thick carbon layor and indeed it looks like they are
missing for quite some time.

I could not inmagine since the engine is running so smooth and nice she has eating some off them, i was planning to take off the manifold again and do some more investigating with a boroscope but for now i am gonna leave it asis.

During the last time i took the manifold of i tried to check as best to see if there where any out there i also used a mechincal finger but nothing.
I cleaned out the inlet bores and sucked the out carbon as much as i could with a high press vac. machine.

I have used the m6 bolts from the timming belt cover and when i think of it i geuss i maybe over did them....
i found when i got the main nut off the the pulley was really wobley and give the bolts some turns to secure
the pulley close and tight so it had no play anymore. Geuss i should not have done that as you mention only finger tight :unsure:.

Brgds,

Klaas
 
#419 ·
Brilliant thread. Lots of useful see tips that make the job that bit easier. Just deflapped my 2008 147 Q2. They were all present and everything looked in decent condition. Took quite a bit of effort to break the welds. There was a bit of carbon build up but not bad for 88k miles. At least I don't have to worry about catastrophic failure anymore. Thanks guys!
 
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